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Your comment seems to imply that a lot of resources are wasted developing the runtime. However, that's not the case. E.g. the Haskell runtime is kind of "done"

by dons 16y ago

Your comment seems to imply that a lot of resources are wasted developing the runtime. However, that's not the case. E.g. the Haskell runtime is kind of "done" -- its not like that's the weak spot, going by any metric. And it is robust and has great performance. http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/u64q/benchmark.php?test=all&lang=ghc http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/u64q/benchmark.php?test=al... Having a runtime doesn't free up any grunt programmers -- since they're not involved in writing the runtime in the first place. ------- Edit I really don't understand "sharing a runtime with something like Java delegates all the grunt work to the legions of Java programmers" sharing the libraries helps delegate gruntwork. Sharing the runtime does very little for a mature language.

cageface 16y ago
Haskell does seem to have a good runtime, although I've read lots of posts talking about problems with high memory load. How much could you have accomplished if you hadn't had to spend resources on building that runtime though? How much energy are you going to expend going forward maintaining parity with the JVM, with 1/100th of the resources? And I really do mean runtime. You can share libraries in any language but sharing a runtime with Java means I get things like bulletproof Oracle drivers, Hadoop, Netty, Mina for free and I can use Scala at the top of a very rich food chain. It took me all of about 15 minutes to get Hadoop queries running in Scala. What's the Haskell story there?
- dons 16y ago
  > get things like bulletproof Oracle drivers, Hadoop, Netty, Mina No, that means sharing libraries. You're using Java libraries now. The JVM has nothing to do with Oracle. > read lots of posts talking about problems with high memory load Look at the shootout stats. The JVM is a memory hog in comparison.
  - cageface 16y ago
    No, that means sharing libraries. You're using Java libraries now. The JVM has nothing to do with Oracle. I'm sharing libraries with Java. I don't have to wait for somebody to write a Scala version. Big difference. The JVM is a hog but it also holds up really high well under high memory and CPU load. Much better than most other VMs.

by dons 16y ago

cageface 16y ago

Haskell does seem to have a good runtime, although I've read lots of posts talking about problems with high memory load. How much could you have accomplished if you hadn't had to spend resources on building that runtime though? How much energy are you going to expend going forward maintaining parity with the JVM, with 1/100th of the resources? And I really do mean runtime. You can share libraries in any language but sharing a runtime with Java means I get things like bulletproof Oracle drivers, Hadoop, Netty, Mina for free and I can use Scala at the top of a very rich food chain. It took me all of about 15 minutes to get Hadoop queries running in Scala. What's the Haskell story there?

dons 16y ago
> get things like bulletproof Oracle drivers, Hadoop, Netty, Mina No, that means sharing libraries. You're using Java libraries now. The JVM has nothing to do with Oracle. > read lots of posts talking about problems with high memory load Look at the shootout stats. The JVM is a memory hog in comparison.
- cageface 16y ago
  No, that means sharing libraries. You're using Java libraries now. The JVM has nothing to do with Oracle. I'm sharing libraries with Java. I don't have to wait for somebody to write a Scala version. Big difference. The JVM is a hog but it also holds up really high well under high memory and CPU load. Much better than most other VMs.