4 ms·

Plenty will tell you: not very often, day to day. The algo part isn't objectionable because it's algo or a test. It's objectionable because it doesn't test the

Plenty will tell you: not very often, day to day. The algo part isn't objectionable because it's algo or a test. It's objectionable because it doesn't test the skill set that would be used on the job. I'm sure database admins would be less than thrilled to have to duplicate a mock in CSS. You wouldn't judge an electrician on their carpentry. It's a tired subject that a lot of companies still seem to have trouble grasping.

mindcrime 9y ago
Plenty will tell you: not very often, day to day People will tell you all sorts of things. It's objectionable because it doesn't test the skill set that would be used on the job. Maybe they just say that because that's easier than investing the time to develop a good understanding of basic algorithms? Don't get me wrong... I'm all about specialization of labor and all that, and I'm not saying every programmer in the world needs to be able to write a provably correct implementation of a PriorityQueue from scratch, at the drop of a hat. But I would argue that all developers, front-end or otherwise, benefit from algorithmic knowledge, and that it is reasonable to test front-end devs on that knowledge - to a point. And given how much more complex "web apps" are becoming with pretty complex SPA's delivered with lots of complex logic executing on the "front end" I think that's become even more true over the past few years. It's not like "Front end developer" means "person who does CSS styling and can add a few neat effects to a page using javascript". You wouldn't judge an electrician on their carpentry. No you wouldn't but that analogy really doesn't fit the present discussion at all.
- zebraflask 9y ago
  I think we're missing a key piece of information. I'm referring to companies that want to hire for a specialized role, do no testing germane to the role, but do test competency for the job solely via a skill set that is tangential to the job itself. A lot of places do this. I think it must be a relic of the Google-style interview cargo cult approach to hiring.
cdicelico 9y ago
I'm sorry, but I don't care what you do—if you work in tech, you need to be able to demonstrate an ability to think algorithmically in order to solve problems with a computer. It's a) not acceptable to get by in tech without knowing anything about computers and b) not rocket science—anyone can learn!
- drdrey 9y ago
  What you're saying is true -- but at the same time it is a bit awkward that there are things you need to work on for interviews only. For instance, I have never had to use linked lists in an actual dev job (~6y experience), but they come up so often in interviews that you just have to practice things like loop detection
  - stmw 9y ago
    It's a little awkward, but not so bad if it's within basics, like linked lists - which one may be rusty on but will generally know or re-derive - rather than really specific algorithms. But that's just a starting point, then it's about the interview and the communication and the interaction - exactly like the examples above of talking to real users or colleagues.
  - user5994461 9y ago
    I have to ask. What roles were you in? and what languages did you develop in?
    - stmw 9y ago
      Me?
      - user5994461 9y ago
        the poster who said he never had to use a linkedlist in 6 years.
        9y ago

mindcrime 9y ago

Plenty will tell you: not very often, day to day People will tell you all sorts of things. It's objectionable because it doesn't test the skill set that would be used on the job. Maybe they just say that because that's easier than investing the time to develop a good understanding of basic algorithms? Don't get me wrong... I'm all about specialization of labor and all that, and I'm not saying every programmer in the world needs to be able to write a provably correct implementation of a PriorityQueue from scratch, at the drop of a hat. But I would argue that all developers, front-end or otherwise, benefit from algorithmic knowledge, and that it is reasonable to test front-end devs on that knowledge - to a point. And given how much more complex "web apps" are becoming with pretty complex SPA's delivered with lots of complex logic executing on the "front end" I think that's become even more true over the past few years. It's not like "Front end developer" means "person who does CSS styling and can add a few neat effects to a page using javascript". You wouldn't judge an electrician on their carpentry. No you wouldn't but that analogy really doesn't fit the present discussion at all.

zebraflask 9y ago
I think we're missing a key piece of information. I'm referring to companies that want to hire for a specialized role, do no testing germane to the role, but do test competency for the job solely via a skill set that is tangential to the job itself. A lot of places do this. I think it must be a relic of the Google-style interview cargo cult approach to hiring.

cdicelico 9y ago

I'm sorry, but I don't care what you do—if you work in tech, you need to be able to demonstrate an ability to think algorithmically in order to solve problems with a computer. It's a) not acceptable to get by in tech without knowing anything about computers and b) not rocket science—anyone can learn!

drdrey 9y ago
What you're saying is true -- but at the same time it is a bit awkward that there are things you need to work on for interviews only. For instance, I have never had to use linked lists in an actual dev job (~6y experience), but they come up so often in interviews that you just have to practice things like loop detection
- stmw 9y ago
  It's a little awkward, but not so bad if it's within basics, like linked lists - which one may be rusty on but will generally know or re-derive - rather than really specific algorithms. But that's just a starting point, then it's about the interview and the communication and the interaction - exactly like the examples above of talking to real users or colleagues.
- user5994461 9y ago
  I have to ask. What roles were you in? and what languages did you develop in?
  - stmw 9y ago
    Me?
    - user5994461 9y ago
      the poster who said he never had to use a linkedlist in 6 years.
      - 9y ago