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There's an experience I had in undergrad that's always stuck with me. The computer science department and the careers office jointly brought in some startup fo

There's an experience I had in undergrad that's always stuck with me. The computer science department and the careers office jointly brought in some startup founders to talk about founding or joining startups and take questions; it was really quite a good idea. Someone asked about degrees and majors - do you need a Master's, which degrees are 'relevant', and so on. The first few founders hemmed and hawed, said "technical skills from any degree" and "undergrad is enough" and so on. The last founder didn't play the game. His answer was: "I'm not worried about your name on a sheet of paper. If you're good at what you do, I'll hire you." Cue nervous laughter from the moderator, and a gentle prompt: "but of course it's worth finishing up school for the people who are already here, those are valuable skills, right?" Founder: "I guess I was unclear. If you drop out today, I will hire you. I recommend it." The next year that panel wasn't repeated.

tonyedgecombe 9y ago
Yet we all know that virtually every programming job advertised requires a computer science degree, I'm not convinced it was good advice given the way most companies hire.
- vvanders 9y ago
  Just because it's advertised doesn't mean it's actually required. Much like companies asking for 10 years of Rust experience, from what I've seen qualifications tend to matter less as you get further along in your career.
- leetcrew 9y ago
  the founder was basically saying that, if he somehow knew before the fact that you were good, he would hire you. he certainly would not just hire an arbitrary college dropout. it's essentially a vacuous conditional that sidesteps the fact that a college degree is widely considered a signifier of some minimal level of skill and will of course be one of the primary ways that applicants are evaluated, unless they somehow have substantial work experience at the age of 20.
  - Jhsto 9y ago
    > unless they somehow have substantial work experience at the age of 20 This is going to be very anecdotal, but that merit is even more run by buzzwords than qualitative inspection of one's skills compared to a degree. I had the privilege to be employed as 20-year old in Silicon Valley as a foreigner, but I did not find myself doing more challenging work than I had before. However, namedropping Silicon Valley on my CV had huge implications back in my home country once I returned (because ironically I did not have a degree). The interesting part is that not a single workplace back in my home country has yet conducted a technical review for me, yet I have been given offer letters. What I am saying is that while some people feel like a BSc is a dumb obligation, the path of having a prestigious CV isn't much better. Instead, if you happen to have one, the chances are that some CV buzzwords are regarded as, as you said about degrees: > considered a signifier of some minimal level of skill and will of course be one of the primary ways that applicants are evaluated Yet I find this alarmingly false. This has caused me to stray away of those companies, as I don't really want to be employed somewhere where people are hired like this either.
- mikeokner 9y ago
  Every single job I've take has advertised that a degree is required. After joining, I've always had at least one co-worker without a degree (usually in some sort of respected, senior role). A degree certainly makes things easier, but everything in business is negotiable.
- Bartweiss 9y ago
  I'm not convinced it was good advice for most people. I'm pretty sure the guy meant it for his company, but I would definitely have worried about ending up locked into a small pool of employers. What made it memorable for me was mostly watching people freeze up and basically try to avoid the suggestion. I certainly think there are people for whom dropping out of college to work at a startup is sensible, and yet no one was going to even discuss the merits of the comment.

tonyedgecombe 9y ago

Yet we all know that virtually every programming job advertised requires a computer science degree, I'm not convinced it was good advice given the way most companies hire.

vvanders 9y ago
Just because it's advertised doesn't mean it's actually required. Much like companies asking for 10 years of Rust experience, from what I've seen qualifications tend to matter less as you get further along in your career.
leetcrew 9y ago
the founder was basically saying that, if he somehow knew before the fact that you were good, he would hire you. he certainly would not just hire an arbitrary college dropout. it's essentially a vacuous conditional that sidesteps the fact that a college degree is widely considered a signifier of some minimal level of skill and will of course be one of the primary ways that applicants are evaluated, unless they somehow have substantial work experience at the age of 20.
- Jhsto 9y ago
  > unless they somehow have substantial work experience at the age of 20 This is going to be very anecdotal, but that merit is even more run by buzzwords than qualitative inspection of one's skills compared to a degree. I had the privilege to be employed as 20-year old in Silicon Valley as a foreigner, but I did not find myself doing more challenging work than I had before. However, namedropping Silicon Valley on my CV had huge implications back in my home country once I returned (because ironically I did not have a degree). The interesting part is that not a single workplace back in my home country has yet conducted a technical review for me, yet I have been given offer letters. What I am saying is that while some people feel like a BSc is a dumb obligation, the path of having a prestigious CV isn't much better. Instead, if you happen to have one, the chances are that some CV buzzwords are regarded as, as you said about degrees: > considered a signifier of some minimal level of skill and will of course be one of the primary ways that applicants are evaluated Yet I find this alarmingly false. This has caused me to stray away of those companies, as I don't really want to be employed somewhere where people are hired like this either.
mikeokner 9y ago
Every single job I've take has advertised that a degree is required. After joining, I've always had at least one co-worker without a degree (usually in some sort of respected, senior role). A degree certainly makes things easier, but everything in business is negotiable.
Bartweiss 9y ago
I'm not convinced it was good advice for most people. I'm pretty sure the guy meant it for his company, but I would definitely have worried about ending up locked into a small pool of employers. What made it memorable for me was mostly watching people freeze up and basically try to avoid the suggestion. I certainly think there are people for whom dropping out of college to work at a startup is sensible, and yet no one was going to even discuss the merits of the comment.