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I think the GP was referring to turning off the auto train on faces when entering the correct passcode feature
by tonmoy 9y ago
I think the GP was referring to turning off the auto train on faces when entering the correct passcode feature
- mikeash 9y agoYou can easily “turn it off” by not giving other people your passcode.
- nikanj 9y agoScenario: I'm driving, my wife tells me I got a text. I tell her my passcode, so she can read it for me. iPhone considers this an opportunity to train the face recognition to recognize "me" better. It doesn't bother me that she can unlock my phone, but I bet the facial model my phone has for "my" features is a weird hybrid.
- mikeash 9y agoSo, don’t do that? Systems don’t have to support every conceivable use case.
- ceejayoz 9y agoThat's a cop-out. This is an extremely common use case.
- mikeash 9y agoReally? First I’ve heard of it.
- johanj 9y agoReally? It’s been discussed a lot on various podcasts, on Twitter and I’ve heard multiple people IRL talk about that use case and the slightly annoyance it is with the iPhone X. It is pretty common for spouses to have a finger added on their spouse’s phone for unlocking it with Touch ID, e.g., when you’re driving and get a message, you can give it to your spouse who can reply. Many parents also have a finger added on their young children’s phones. None if these scenarios are really possible with Face ID, because you’ll end up training Face ID with two faces. And while phones are usually used by only a single person, it is not an uncommon scenario to have a secondary user.
- mikeash 9y agoYes, really. I don't listen to technical podcasts, and I haven't seen any Twitter or IRL stuff about it. Anyway, if you want to have a shared phone like this, get one that has Touch ID. Apple offers both. Or trust that Apple does this intelligently and doesn't train the facial recognition in this case when the face is too far out of bounds. As other commenters mentioned, I'm pretty sure that's how it works. It's not training based on your wife's face unless she looks a lot like you. And in that case, you want her to be able to unlock your phone, so isn't it a good thing?
- valuearb 9y agoThat second face has to look a lot like yours to get adddd via training. And if you are one of those couples that look alike enough to be able to train the phone, why do you care? You already gave your spouse full access via your passcode.
- mrep 9y agoMy girlfriend and I have our fingerprints on each other's phones and it is super useful. She can change the music on my phone while driving, look up stuff for me to enter into maps, and do everything else with it.
- ceejayoz 9y agoIt doesn't occur to you that spouses might have access to each other's phone passcodes?
- giobox 9y agoWe do this as well, except now my wife just grabs my phone and points it at my face in the car to unlock rather than use the passcode. This works pretty easily if you have the “attention detection” feature turned off. Not arguing this is ideal, but it works and avoids retrains, although Apple have publicly stated retrains only occur if they believe the face matches above a base threshold, which makes it much less likely a female face will retrain on a male Face ID user’s phone, and vice versa. It doesn’t retrain on every passcode entry. https://images.apple.com/business/docs/FaceID_Security_Guide.pdf https://images.apple.com/business/docs/FaceID_Security_Guide...
- ghthor 9y agoSeem like it's be easier to just ask the user if the face should be used for re-training instead of hiding this behind a heuristic.
- izuchukwu 9y agoFace ID only updates its model from a subsequent passcode unlock if the failed recognition was a close match, so your model should be ok. https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208108 https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT208108
- neom 9y agoI should have noted in my example that the Xu sisters look very "similar".
- gnicholas 9y agoI would guess that the training algorithm doesn't update your face unless the alternate face looks sufficiently similar to yours. This covers new facial hair and weight loss/gain, but would exclude the (very common) spouse issue that you describe — unless you look very similar.
- lotsofpulp 9y agoOh oops, I didn't read carefully enough. Regardless, I think if you're interested in real security, both TouchID and FaceID are terrible (easy to use your body, by force if necessary, to bypass those), and passcode is the only secure option. FaceID and TouchID are just conveniences not affordable to those who have something to lose.
- happythomist 9y agoThere's nothing stopping a malicious actor from acquiring a passcode by force as well. https://xkcd.com/538/ https://xkcd.com/538/
- valuearb 9y agopasscodes are the least secure method for almost everyone.
- deleted 9y ago[deleted]