4 ms·

> it is illegal to possess bulletproof or stab-proof clothing without a permit. (!) I can see the bulletproof part - don't want criminals to be wearing it and

by rdtsc 9y ago

> it is illegal to possess bulletproof or stab-proof clothing without a permit. (!) I can see the bulletproof part - don't want criminals to be wearing it and thus forcing police to have high power rifles around to take them down, which also might mean those kind of weapons would get in the hands of criminals as well through the black market and such. What's the logic with stab-proof clothing then? Does police in Canada carry knives and is forced to use them to stop criminals.

njharman 9y ago
Yeah cause criminals only ever use guns that police are allowed to have.
- rdtsc 9y ago
  I didn't say I agree with that logic, but I can see someone subscribing to it. I don't see the logic for the anti-stab clothing though.
jsjohnst 9y ago
> I can see the bulletproof part - don't want criminals to be wearing it and thus forcing police to have high power rifles around to take them down Bullet proof clothing typically covers the chest area and wearing it doesn’t mean you won’t be injured. As a police officer’s primary job is to diffuse a crisis situation, not “kill every suspected perp”, I see minimal reason a bullet proof vest on the perp would impact the police significantly. Try getting shot, especially multiple times, wearing a bullet proof vest and you’ll understand completely why my opinion isn’t out of line.
- GuiA 9y ago
  > Try getting shot, especially multiple times, wearing a bullet proof vest and you’ll understand completely why my opinion isn’t out of line. What is it like, for those of us who don't have guns and bulletproof vests on hands to experiment? Does it knock the breath out of you? Would it bring you to the ground?
  - kurthr 9y ago
    Depending on the (edit handgun) caliber it could bring you to the ground even with adrenaline flowing. You will end up with large bruises for sure. If there is a rifle involved >.22 caliber, then you will likely face penetration unless you have a trauma plate. Body extremities really can't be effectively protected.
    - nuclearchicken 9y ago
      3A Body Armor vs. 5.56 Nato and 7.62 x 39 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JwlzR5nPFw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JwlzR5nPFw 3A Body Armor vs.12ga. Buckshot and Slugs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qSVOZfp3R4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qSVOZfp3R4 3A Body Armor vs. Pistol Caliber Carbines https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ia1k1Zg4l2A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ia1k1Zg4l2A
    - lwhalen 9y ago
      https://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-1-the-original-box-o-truth/ https://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-1-the-original-... Handguns are handguns. Rifles are rifles.
      - kurthr 9y ago
        Yes, caliber and grains matter too (in addition to barrel). A rim fire .22 is so different from a .223, that it's comparing them is almost useless (but not quite). Just look at the cartridge and it becomes very clear... http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2011/05/03/guest-post-22-lr-vs-223-rem/ http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2011/05/03/guest-post-22-...
    - Wingman4l7 9y ago
      Might break a rib too, no? I've seen a video of tests on clay dummies so they can see the depth of damage from the impact behind the vest.
  - Trav5 9y ago
    It depends on how far away, and what you were shot with... vests are designed to block hand guns, not rifels. It may not stop every bullet. A larger hand gun, say 50cal, has more recoil and is harder to aim with sequential shots, thus not practical... but feels amazing and is so loud! I believe it would take a person down and possibly kill them. I've been told police are taught 2 to the chest 1 to the head. From my quick googling, a great read: "...Among the accounts from those who have experienced being shot while wearing a bulletproof vest (and lived to talk about it), there is one consistent analogy to describe the feeling: being hit with a baseball bat. ..." http://www.ponderweasel.com/shot-wearing-a-bulletproof-vest/ http://www.ponderweasel.com/shot-wearing-a-bulletproof-vest/
Karnickel 9y ago
I don't think that that is the idea. I think the reason is similar to what was shown for seat belts: When you know you are protected you take more risks. If criminals can protect themselves they are probably more likely to use violence in the first place.

by rdtsc 9y ago

njharman 9y ago

Yeah cause criminals only ever use guns that police are allowed to have.

rdtsc 9y ago
I didn't say I agree with that logic, but I can see someone subscribing to it. I don't see the logic for the anti-stab clothing though.

jsjohnst 9y ago

> I can see the bulletproof part - don't want criminals to be wearing it and thus forcing police to have high power rifles around to take them down Bullet proof clothing typically covers the chest area and wearing it doesn’t mean you won’t be injured. As a police officer’s primary job is to diffuse a crisis situation, not “kill every suspected perp”, I see minimal reason a bullet proof vest on the perp would impact the police significantly. Try getting shot, especially multiple times, wearing a bullet proof vest and you’ll understand completely why my opinion isn’t out of line.

GuiA 9y ago
> Try getting shot, especially multiple times, wearing a bullet proof vest and you’ll understand completely why my opinion isn’t out of line. What is it like, for those of us who don't have guns and bulletproof vests on hands to experiment? Does it knock the breath out of you? Would it bring you to the ground?
- kurthr 9y ago
  Depending on the (edit handgun) caliber it could bring you to the ground even with adrenaline flowing. You will end up with large bruises for sure. If there is a rifle involved >.22 caliber, then you will likely face penetration unless you have a trauma plate. Body extremities really can't be effectively protected.
  - nuclearchicken 9y ago
    3A Body Armor vs. 5.56 Nato and 7.62 x 39 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JwlzR5nPFw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JwlzR5nPFw 3A Body Armor vs.12ga. Buckshot and Slugs https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qSVOZfp3R4 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4qSVOZfp3R4 3A Body Armor vs. Pistol Caliber Carbines https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ia1k1Zg4l2A https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ia1k1Zg4l2A
  - lwhalen 9y ago
    https://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-1-the-original-box-o-truth/ https://www.theboxotruth.com/the-box-o-truth-1-the-original-... Handguns are handguns. Rifles are rifles.
    - kurthr 9y ago
      Yes, caliber and grains matter too (in addition to barrel). A rim fire .22 is so different from a .223, that it's comparing them is almost useless (but not quite). Just look at the cartridge and it becomes very clear... http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2011/05/03/guest-post-22-lr-vs-223-rem/ http://www.thefirearmblog.com/blog/2011/05/03/guest-post-22-...
  - Wingman4l7 9y ago
    Might break a rib too, no? I've seen a video of tests on clay dummies so they can see the depth of damage from the impact behind the vest.
- Trav5 9y ago
  It depends on how far away, and what you were shot with... vests are designed to block hand guns, not rifels. It may not stop every bullet. A larger hand gun, say 50cal, has more recoil and is harder to aim with sequential shots, thus not practical... but feels amazing and is so loud! I believe it would take a person down and possibly kill them. I've been told police are taught 2 to the chest 1 to the head. From my quick googling, a great read: "...Among the accounts from those who have experienced being shot while wearing a bulletproof vest (and lived to talk about it), there is one consistent analogy to describe the feeling: being hit with a baseball bat. ..." http://www.ponderweasel.com/shot-wearing-a-bulletproof-vest/ http://www.ponderweasel.com/shot-wearing-a-bulletproof-vest/

Karnickel 9y ago

I don't think that that is the idea. I think the reason is similar to what was shown for seat belts: When you know you are protected you take more risks. If criminals can protect themselves they are probably more likely to use violence in the first place.