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I like nuanced comments and you make cogent arguments. However, I believe that most people in group 1, are in fact aware of the problem of their behaviour and a

I like nuanced comments and you make cogent arguments. However, I believe that most people in group 1, are in fact aware of the problem of their behaviour and are willingly ignorant of it. This is because if they made any unwanted advances against women, even if the women didn't tell them to stop or publicly humiliate them, they surely ignored or tried to get away from the situation. At the very least the victim did not enjoy it and that is feedback enough. Anywhere in the course of history where there was a stronger party forcing themselves on a weaker party, the pain of the weaker party is visible in plain sight and ignored by the stronger party. Now the question boils down to whether a perpetrator considers the victim to be a human with a standing equal to his/her own. The answer to that question has been a resounding no, whether it was slavery or war crimes or sexual assault. To summarize, lack of feedback cannot be the reason, willful ignorance and dehumanization perhaps is and that is something the victim cannot be tasked with rectifying.

imartin2k 9y ago
I still think you seem to lack the willingness to engage in exploring how these type of men think, which also means that your verdict about lack of feedback not being the reason doesn’t appear too convincing to me. Otherwise you would be aware that “being ignored” is widely considered “playing hard to get” among men with this mindset. Emphasis on “play”. If one has been exposed to a certain type of mindset and has internalized it, this person’s viewpoint and their perception of reality might be absolutely different than yours (and mine). This of course is a re-occuring theme of the past year(s). People not making the effort to understand why others act/behave/vote radically different. It seems to be unbelievably hard to acknowledge that what might be despicible from one’s own viewpoint might appear completely reasonable from someone else’s in their specific context. Which doesn‘t excuse their actions but explains why they have not been seeing/noticing the obvious damage of their behavioral patters. In order to change that person’s viewpoint requires work from the ground up.

imartin2k 9y ago

I still think you seem to lack the willingness to engage in exploring how these type of men think, which also means that your verdict about lack of feedback not being the reason doesn’t appear too convincing to me. Otherwise you would be aware that “being ignored” is widely considered “playing hard to get” among men with this mindset. Emphasis on “play”. If one has been exposed to a certain type of mindset and has internalized it, this person’s viewpoint and their perception of reality might be absolutely different than yours (and mine). This of course is a re-occuring theme of the past year(s). People not making the effort to understand why others act/behave/vote radically different. It seems to be unbelievably hard to acknowledge that what might be despicible from one’s own viewpoint might appear completely reasonable from someone else’s in their specific context. Which doesn‘t excuse their actions but explains why they have not been seeing/noticing the obvious damage of their behavioral patters. In order to change that person’s viewpoint requires work from the ground up.