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One thing Canadians miss in the “CanCon means shitty TV” meme is that CanCon rules mean Canadian creative talent is cultivated. You don’t just become a great TV

One thing Canadians miss in the “CanCon means shitty TV” meme is that CanCon rules mean Canadian creative talent is cultivated. You don’t just become a great TV writer overnight. You write a lot of shitty TV until you get good at it. This is not unlike programming. Why do you think there are so many successful Canadians in Hollywood? A bunch got their start in productions that wouldn’t be around if not for CanCon. I mean for crying out loud, Drake, who is possibly one of the greatest cultural entrepreneurs of our time got his start on Degrassi. It’s not perfect by any means but Canadians tend to forget this aspect of the system whereby Canadian talent is cultivated, they go to the US to learn even more, then return to help educate the next generation of Canadian talent (eg Norman Jewison and the Canadian Film Centre)

smsm42 9y ago
> This is not unlike programming. You mean, Canada should mandate certain percentage of software be written in Canada too, and if your site or software product doesn't run X% of Canadian software, you should not be able to use it within Canada? Great idea, sure.
- Spooky23 9y ago
  Nations need to think about strategic interests beyond the capitalist trope that motivates most of us. It’s not in Canada’s national interest for Toronto to be a remote suburb of the US east coast. If and when relations between the two nations degrade, Canada needs to be able to continue functioning. That’s the danger of the mercurial Trump administration. The random shit that speed out of the US is making everyone question everything.
  - smsm42 9y ago
    > Nations need to think about strategic interests beyond the capitalist trope that motivates most of us. So, are you agreeing with me that it'd be good for Canadian government to require software (or at least significant part of it) be made in Canada? > If and when relations between the two nations degrade, Canada needs to be able to continue functioning. Thus, Canada should build its own Linux, its own Windows, its own Google, its own Facebook, its own Amazon and so on... Just in case they ever have bad relationships with the US, you know. And since nobody would use those while US alternatives are available, it would make sense to ban Canadians from using US equivalents - for their own good. After all, this model is being used with great success in China. > The random shit that speed out of the US is making everyone question everything. I have read this phrase five times and still have no idea what do you mean. Is it wrong to question things? Is Trump making people question things they did not question before and somehow it is bad? Is Canada being hurt because people were not daring to question things before Trump and are questioning them now, and these things can not withstand questioning? Frankly, I am a bit lost here.
    - 9oliYQjP 9y ago
      The Canadian government routinely enters into contracts with foreign companies with the requirement that those companies create Canadian jobs while executing the work under that contract. These cover a diverse range of industries from defence (e.g. Boeing) through technology (e.g. Hewlett-Packard, Microsoft). In this respect, CanCon isn't philosophically inconsistent with the government's other policies. Those that support CanCon would say it's a defence of Canadian culture at an existential level. It's not dissimilar to the U.S. requiring that Toyota build cars in Alabama if it wants to keep selling to Americans. These things happen under the most business friendly governments and are expected to increase in the U.S. under President Trump's desired new regulations of private sector trade. Microsoft, Google, Facebook, and Amazon all have Canadian-specific offerings operated in Canada and backed by actual Canadian employees that would be analogous to CanCon productions such as X-Files. There seems to be a misconception that CanCon means pure 100% offerings from the CBC. But that's not the case at all. For example, here's a good take on many Canadian actors who were part of X-Files while it filmed in Vancouver. Actors ranging from Cancer Man to the Lone Gunmen were all Canadian. https://etcanada.com/photos/119349/the-x-files-canadian-connections/ https://etcanada.com/photos/119349/the-x-files-canadian-conn...
      - smsm42 9y ago
        > routinely enters into contracts with foreign companies with the requirement that those companies create Canadian jobs while executing the work under that contract Sure, for the price of government contract you can always find some things to do for some Canadians (and not that Canadians are bad at doing stuff, so they may be hired anyway, with or without this requirement, but since there is a special requirement, you could always ask for the special price...). Or invent them if needed. The funny thing is that any extra money spent on this requirement is taken from other Canadians... > In this respect, CanCon isn't philosophically inconsistent with the government's other policies. Oh, I'm not saying it's inconsistent with other policies. If anything, the tradition of "creating of jobs" (also known under the name of "broken window fallacy") is very popular among politicians of all kinds, and for a clear reason - the benefits of it are concentrated and easy to show, while the costs are distributed and easy to hide. > Microsoft, Google, Facebook, and Amazon all have Canadian-specific offerings The question is not whether Canada should allow Microsoft to open its office in Canada, but whether it should force it to do so under the threat of being excluded from the Canadian market and prohibiting Canadians from using Microsoft products. Some people apparently think it'd be a great idea. > For example, here's a good take on many Canadian actors who were part of X-Files while it filmed in Vancouver I know a lot of quality Canadian production and actors (see my other comment in this thread about Canadian shows). Which begs the question - apparently Canadians are doing fine even on the market as strong and competitive as US TV/movie scene. Despite the fact that CBC has no way to force any US network to show Canadian content, as far as I know - they willingly do so, and not once but quite frequently. So why there's a need to do the same on Canadian market - what makes one think Canadian companies can withstand competition with Hollywood on Hollywood's own soil, but would inevitably lose in Canada if only CBC didn't take regulatory measures to prevent it?
  - WillPostForFood 9y ago
    You criticizing Trump but also echoing his rhetoric - Make Canada Great Again, keep Canadian TV Canadian.
    - Spooky23 9y ago
      No, I have no strong opinion about this Canadian policy. All I said is that there is a legitimate rationale for the Canadian policy, and that Canada has a strategic interest to be more than just an American vassal with quaint accents. Trump and the situation in the United States is different. We are a sort of economic empire — we industrialize culture and push it out everywhere. Kids in Africa know about the NBA and hip hop. People in China are super fans of the 90s TV show “Friends”.
- 9oliYQjP 9y ago
  I don't think my comment was claiming what should be done. I was merely explaining why such a popular meme of "CanCon sucks" is so widespread yet hasn't been fundamentally dismantled by any government of any political stripe.

smsm42 9y ago

> This is not unlike programming. You mean, Canada should mandate certain percentage of software be written in Canada too, and if your site or software product doesn't run X% of Canadian software, you should not be able to use it within Canada? Great idea, sure.

Spooky23 9y ago
Nations need to think about strategic interests beyond the capitalist trope that motivates most of us. It’s not in Canada’s national interest for Toronto to be a remote suburb of the US east coast. If and when relations between the two nations degrade, Canada needs to be able to continue functioning. That’s the danger of the mercurial Trump administration. The random shit that speed out of the US is making everyone question everything.
- smsm42 9y ago
  > Nations need to think about strategic interests beyond the capitalist trope that motivates most of us. So, are you agreeing with me that it'd be good for Canadian government to require software (or at least significant part of it) be made in Canada? > If and when relations between the two nations degrade, Canada needs to be able to continue functioning. Thus, Canada should build its own Linux, its own Windows, its own Google, its own Facebook, its own Amazon and so on... Just in case they ever have bad relationships with the US, you know. And since nobody would use those while US alternatives are available, it would make sense to ban Canadians from using US equivalents - for their own good. After all, this model is being used with great success in China. > The random shit that speed out of the US is making everyone question everything. I have read this phrase five times and still have no idea what do you mean. Is it wrong to question things? Is Trump making people question things they did not question before and somehow it is bad? Is Canada being hurt because people were not daring to question things before Trump and are questioning them now, and these things can not withstand questioning? Frankly, I am a bit lost here.
  - 9oliYQjP 9y ago
    The Canadian government routinely enters into contracts with foreign companies with the requirement that those companies create Canadian jobs while executing the work under that contract. These cover a diverse range of industries from defence (e.g. Boeing) through technology (e.g. Hewlett-Packard, Microsoft). In this respect, CanCon isn't philosophically inconsistent with the government's other policies. Those that support CanCon would say it's a defence of Canadian culture at an existential level. It's not dissimilar to the U.S. requiring that Toyota build cars in Alabama if it wants to keep selling to Americans. These things happen under the most business friendly governments and are expected to increase in the U.S. under President Trump's desired new regulations of private sector trade. Microsoft, Google, Facebook, and Amazon all have Canadian-specific offerings operated in Canada and backed by actual Canadian employees that would be analogous to CanCon productions such as X-Files. There seems to be a misconception that CanCon means pure 100% offerings from the CBC. But that's not the case at all. For example, here's a good take on many Canadian actors who were part of X-Files while it filmed in Vancouver. Actors ranging from Cancer Man to the Lone Gunmen were all Canadian. https://etcanada.com/photos/119349/the-x-files-canadian-connections/ https://etcanada.com/photos/119349/the-x-files-canadian-conn...
    - smsm42 9y ago
      > routinely enters into contracts with foreign companies with the requirement that those companies create Canadian jobs while executing the work under that contract Sure, for the price of government contract you can always find some things to do for some Canadians (and not that Canadians are bad at doing stuff, so they may be hired anyway, with or without this requirement, but since there is a special requirement, you could always ask for the special price...). Or invent them if needed. The funny thing is that any extra money spent on this requirement is taken from other Canadians... > In this respect, CanCon isn't philosophically inconsistent with the government's other policies. Oh, I'm not saying it's inconsistent with other policies. If anything, the tradition of "creating of jobs" (also known under the name of "broken window fallacy") is very popular among politicians of all kinds, and for a clear reason - the benefits of it are concentrated and easy to show, while the costs are distributed and easy to hide. > Microsoft, Google, Facebook, and Amazon all have Canadian-specific offerings The question is not whether Canada should allow Microsoft to open its office in Canada, but whether it should force it to do so under the threat of being excluded from the Canadian market and prohibiting Canadians from using Microsoft products. Some people apparently think it'd be a great idea. > For example, here's a good take on many Canadian actors who were part of X-Files while it filmed in Vancouver I know a lot of quality Canadian production and actors (see my other comment in this thread about Canadian shows). Which begs the question - apparently Canadians are doing fine even on the market as strong and competitive as US TV/movie scene. Despite the fact that CBC has no way to force any US network to show Canadian content, as far as I know - they willingly do so, and not once but quite frequently. So why there's a need to do the same on Canadian market - what makes one think Canadian companies can withstand competition with Hollywood on Hollywood's own soil, but would inevitably lose in Canada if only CBC didn't take regulatory measures to prevent it?
- WillPostForFood 9y ago
  You criticizing Trump but also echoing his rhetoric - Make Canada Great Again, keep Canadian TV Canadian.
  - Spooky23 9y ago
    No, I have no strong opinion about this Canadian policy. All I said is that there is a legitimate rationale for the Canadian policy, and that Canada has a strategic interest to be more than just an American vassal with quaint accents. Trump and the situation in the United States is different. We are a sort of economic empire — we industrialize culture and push it out everywhere. Kids in Africa know about the NBA and hip hop. People in China are super fans of the 90s TV show “Friends”.
9oliYQjP 9y ago
I don't think my comment was claiming what should be done. I was merely explaining why such a popular meme of "CanCon sucks" is so widespread yet hasn't been fundamentally dismantled by any government of any political stripe.