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>And the Democrats have spun reasonable measures, such as requiring some sort of identification to vote, as "suppression", possibly so those who aren't citizens

>And the Democrats have spun reasonable measures, such as requiring some sort of identification to vote, as "suppression", possibly so those who aren't citizens can vote. Who cheats more? Who knows. Everyone knows: it's the Republicans, and it's not close. Voter fraud is not real. It doesn't happen. It's kind of amazing that it doesn't, but that's the facts. Voter ID laws and stringent voter registration laws do disproportionately suppress the vote of Democratic-leaning subpopulations; that's also a proven fact that's not up for debate. Poor and non-white voters are less likely to have acceptable identification readily to hand, and even when they do, poll workers in certain areas have a bad habit of suddenly changing the rules or not accepting identification for certain voters.

blunte 9y ago
And closing voting stations or greatly limiting hours (typically to work-day periods, when hourly wage earners cannot reasonably take off).
- jules 9y ago
  Wouldn't this suppress republicans more than democrats?
  - arkades 9y ago
    As implemented thus far, they close stations (and post offices, as far as ID requirements go) in democratic districts. Travel plus hour limits mean Democrats from democratic districts literally can’t get to a voting station in time unless they take off a full day of work to accommodate it.
peoplewindow 9y ago
If people don't have ID how can you know that there's no fraud? That seems kind of circular. It's kind of amazing that this is even a debate, what kind of voting system doesn't require you to prove you're a citizen? I'm not sure you should be so trusting of studies of ID fraud. For the longest time it was claimed in Europe that migrants who 'lose' their ID and commit asylum fraud are a tiny proportion of the total. Now there are large scale medical studies being done and it turns out in some countries that maybe 70-80% of the asylum seekers who claimed to be children are in fact over 18. Many of the lost ID documents were deliberately lost or destroyed to enable this sort of thing.
- kingosticks 9y ago
  Do you have a link to one of those studies?
  - clickok 9y ago
    According to: https://www.rmv.se/aktuellt/det-visar-tre-manader-av-medicinska-aldersbedomningar/ https://www.rmv.se/aktuellt/det-visar-tre-manader-av-medicin... I don't speak Swedish, so I had to translate it (the site I found the link from[0] after Googling seems like it has an axe to grind). They indicate that, of ~2400 refugees where the National Medical Board rendered an opinion, some ~2000 were estimated to be eighteen years of age or older, with ~400 estimated to be under eighteen years of age (so ~5/6). This may be different from the patterns in general because these are cases where the board was asked for and subsequently rendered an opinion. It might be that (contra the headlines) this sort of misrepresentation is relatively rare, and the rate for the subset of the population where no questions were raised is substantially lower. ----- 0. https://nationaleconomicseditorial.com/2017/07/15/sweden-child-migrants/ https://nationaleconomicseditorial.com/2017/07/15/sweden-chi...
    - Khol 9y ago
      It is, perhaps, useful to take into account the context here. These are people who have risked their life to escape from areas in which they are being persecuted, and are taking every step they can to avoid being forcibly returned to those areas.
      - peoplewindow 9y ago
        Without ID you don't actually know that. They claim to be asylum seekers but you don't know where they're from.
- zimpenfish 9y ago
  > what kind of voting system doesn't require you to prove you're a citizen? The UK, really. If you know someone's name and address, you can steal their vote pretty easily. https://www.gov.uk/voting-in-the-uk/polling-stations https://www.gov.uk/voting-in-the-uk/polling-stations > Give your name and address to the staff inside the polling station when you arrive. You don’t have to take your poll card with you.
fastball 9y ago
proven fact Source?

blunte 9y ago

And closing voting stations or greatly limiting hours (typically to work-day periods, when hourly wage earners cannot reasonably take off).

jules 9y ago
Wouldn't this suppress republicans more than democrats?
- arkades 9y ago
  As implemented thus far, they close stations (and post offices, as far as ID requirements go) in democratic districts. Travel plus hour limits mean Democrats from democratic districts literally can’t get to a voting station in time unless they take off a full day of work to accommodate it.

peoplewindow 9y ago

If people don't have ID how can you know that there's no fraud? That seems kind of circular. It's kind of amazing that this is even a debate, what kind of voting system doesn't require you to prove you're a citizen? I'm not sure you should be so trusting of studies of ID fraud. For the longest time it was claimed in Europe that migrants who 'lose' their ID and commit asylum fraud are a tiny proportion of the total. Now there are large scale medical studies being done and it turns out in some countries that maybe 70-80% of the asylum seekers who claimed to be children are in fact over 18. Many of the lost ID documents were deliberately lost or destroyed to enable this sort of thing.

kingosticks 9y ago
Do you have a link to one of those studies?
- clickok 9y ago
  According to: https://www.rmv.se/aktuellt/det-visar-tre-manader-av-medicinska-aldersbedomningar/ https://www.rmv.se/aktuellt/det-visar-tre-manader-av-medicin... I don't speak Swedish, so I had to translate it (the site I found the link from[0] after Googling seems like it has an axe to grind). They indicate that, of ~2400 refugees where the National Medical Board rendered an opinion, some ~2000 were estimated to be eighteen years of age or older, with ~400 estimated to be under eighteen years of age (so ~5/6). This may be different from the patterns in general because these are cases where the board was asked for and subsequently rendered an opinion. It might be that (contra the headlines) this sort of misrepresentation is relatively rare, and the rate for the subset of the population where no questions were raised is substantially lower. ----- 0. https://nationaleconomicseditorial.com/2017/07/15/sweden-child-migrants/ https://nationaleconomicseditorial.com/2017/07/15/sweden-chi...
  - Khol 9y ago
    It is, perhaps, useful to take into account the context here. These are people who have risked their life to escape from areas in which they are being persecuted, and are taking every step they can to avoid being forcibly returned to those areas.
    - peoplewindow 9y ago
      Without ID you don't actually know that. They claim to be asylum seekers but you don't know where they're from.
zimpenfish 9y ago
> what kind of voting system doesn't require you to prove you're a citizen? The UK, really. If you know someone's name and address, you can steal their vote pretty easily. https://www.gov.uk/voting-in-the-uk/polling-stations https://www.gov.uk/voting-in-the-uk/polling-stations > Give your name and address to the staff inside the polling station when you arrive. You don’t have to take your poll card with you.

fastball 9y ago

proven fact Source?