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> How do you move? A train or bus from the Bay Area to Nebraska will run around $100. That’s around the same amount as Bay Area rent costs for just the time sp

> How do you move? A train or bus from the Bay Area to Nebraska will run around $100. That’s around the same amount as Bay Area rent costs for just the time spent on the train/bus during the trip. > How do you find a job? To start, “Help Wanted” signs and odd jobs in the usual places (e.g. Home Depot). Then, network or use free internet at public libraries to search for something better. > Are there really many jobs for burger flippers? There are fewer jobs, but also fewer people attempting to get them. > Are people who flip burgers in Nebraska so much better? Of course not. But they live in a place where population has held steady (graying) instead of growing wildly, where there’s plenty of land, and plenty of housing stock on that land, so housing takes 25% of the burger flipping paycheck instead of 75% (don’t forget commuting time in the cost of housing). As a result, their standard of living is higher. The Bay Area, or any high cost area for that matter, is a great place in which to save 20% of one’s income and a terrible one in which to live paycheck-to-paycheck 0%.

knightofmars 9y ago
TL;DR: "They should just move." is a naive response to the issue presented. Children and family/friends who are around to support you and also sometimes watch your children are often a reason. Could someone move themselves and their two children? Yes, it would cost $300 (to start). Then you'd need to find a place where all three of you could live before you've actually even found a job. This short-term place to live would likely be a motel, meaning you'd likely be unable to cook and spending more on food to feed yourself and your family. Then you need to figure out child care because you've lost the support network of family (and friends) who were living near you. Physical mobility, moving from state to state, in this country is often much harder than the simplistic viewpoint people seem to give it. If your perspective is that of a single individual with no dependents (even if you're poor) then you're going to think that physical mobility is relatively easy and everyone should be able to do it. If your perspective is that of an individual with dependents then you're going to think that physical mobility could quickly become a challenge if you can't afford the upfront costs and short to mid term costs after you've moved and need to "settle" yourself. There are a lot of, "Sure, but..." responses that usually come about with this type of discussion. "Sure, but why couldn't they temporarily go into debt? Their long-term earnings would put them in a better place eventually." and "Sure, but why aren't they applying for food and/or housing assistance or other programs at the location they're planning to move to." or "Sure, but why couldn't they have family watch their kids while they go to the new place and get setup." The reality is those perspectives are from someone educated enough to understand economics, government programs and how the system works, and someone with a supportive well functioning family. All of which someone working a food-service job is unlikely to have.
- dsfyu404ed 9y ago
  The high CoL states generally have pretty strong tenant protection laws. Talk to friends, family, anyone. Find a couch you can crash on for a week while you find a job. Skip your rent to save up for the move, make a small partial payment and go to court to avoid being evicted quickly. Buy a bus ticket and never look back. Children complicate things and working in a trade that's easy to find another job in makes things easier but the basic workflow is the same.
  - knightofmars 9y ago
    Please re-read my "Sure, but..." paragraph and the sentence after it. You just did exactly what I was describing.
- skookumchuck 9y ago
  Sure, but the US was populated by people moving around who had essentially nothing. California's huge population did not spontaneously appear. Millions come to America by walking across the borders.
- Helmet 9y ago
  > The reality is those perspectives are from someone educated enough to understand economics, government programs and how the system works, and someone with a supportive well functioning family. All of which someone working a food-service job is unlikely to have. Don't make assumptions. They can move. My reality is of a first-generation immigrant. My parents did not have degrees and worked minimum wage jobs. They moved multiple times when it became financially unfeasible to live somewhere. It wasn't fun, it sucked a lot actually, but we did what we had to do, not what we wanted to do.
  - frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
    Man you're all over this thread handwaving away real concerns because of your parents. It's totally reasonable to think that a family with kids who moves to Nebraska is still going to be food insecure. If I'm an unskilled worker and I can live in the bay area near my family, where I'm comfortable, where I have friends and I'm food insecure or I can go move out to the Midwest where I have none of that and I'm still food insecure because now I have the added costs of childcare, less public transportation options, etc. AND I have none of the support network I had around SV then there's no way I'm moving. Maybe the difference between all the people in the article mentioned and your parents is that what made sense for your parents actually doesn't make sense for these people.
dragonwriter 9y ago
> A train or bus from the Bay Area to Nebraska will run around $100. That’s around the same amount as Bay Area rent costs for just the time spent on the train/bus during the trip. Congratulations, you're now broke, homeless, jobless, with weak creditworthiness, no connections to local private and public support in Nebraska, needing to somehow acquire food, shelter, and some mechanism of paying for it.

knightofmars 9y ago

TL;DR: "They should just move." is a naive response to the issue presented. Children and family/friends who are around to support you and also sometimes watch your children are often a reason. Could someone move themselves and their two children? Yes, it would cost $300 (to start). Then you'd need to find a place where all three of you could live before you've actually even found a job. This short-term place to live would likely be a motel, meaning you'd likely be unable to cook and spending more on food to feed yourself and your family. Then you need to figure out child care because you've lost the support network of family (and friends) who were living near you. Physical mobility, moving from state to state, in this country is often much harder than the simplistic viewpoint people seem to give it. If your perspective is that of a single individual with no dependents (even if you're poor) then you're going to think that physical mobility is relatively easy and everyone should be able to do it. If your perspective is that of an individual with dependents then you're going to think that physical mobility could quickly become a challenge if you can't afford the upfront costs and short to mid term costs after you've moved and need to "settle" yourself. There are a lot of, "Sure, but..." responses that usually come about with this type of discussion. "Sure, but why couldn't they temporarily go into debt? Their long-term earnings would put them in a better place eventually." and "Sure, but why aren't they applying for food and/or housing assistance or other programs at the location they're planning to move to." or "Sure, but why couldn't they have family watch their kids while they go to the new place and get setup." The reality is those perspectives are from someone educated enough to understand economics, government programs and how the system works, and someone with a supportive well functioning family. All of which someone working a food-service job is unlikely to have.

dsfyu404ed 9y ago
The high CoL states generally have pretty strong tenant protection laws. Talk to friends, family, anyone. Find a couch you can crash on for a week while you find a job. Skip your rent to save up for the move, make a small partial payment and go to court to avoid being evicted quickly. Buy a bus ticket and never look back. Children complicate things and working in a trade that's easy to find another job in makes things easier but the basic workflow is the same.
- knightofmars 9y ago
  Please re-read my "Sure, but..." paragraph and the sentence after it. You just did exactly what I was describing.
skookumchuck 9y ago
Sure, but the US was populated by people moving around who had essentially nothing. California's huge population did not spontaneously appear. Millions come to America by walking across the borders.
Helmet 9y ago
> The reality is those perspectives are from someone educated enough to understand economics, government programs and how the system works, and someone with a supportive well functioning family. All of which someone working a food-service job is unlikely to have. Don't make assumptions. They can move. My reality is of a first-generation immigrant. My parents did not have degrees and worked minimum wage jobs. They moved multiple times when it became financially unfeasible to live somewhere. It wasn't fun, it sucked a lot actually, but we did what we had to do, not what we wanted to do.
- frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
  Man you're all over this thread handwaving away real concerns because of your parents. It's totally reasonable to think that a family with kids who moves to Nebraska is still going to be food insecure. If I'm an unskilled worker and I can live in the bay area near my family, where I'm comfortable, where I have friends and I'm food insecure or I can go move out to the Midwest where I have none of that and I'm still food insecure because now I have the added costs of childcare, less public transportation options, etc. AND I have none of the support network I had around SV then there's no way I'm moving. Maybe the difference between all the people in the article mentioned and your parents is that what made sense for your parents actually doesn't make sense for these people.

dragonwriter 9y ago

> A train or bus from the Bay Area to Nebraska will run around $100. That’s around the same amount as Bay Area rent costs for just the time spent on the train/bus during the trip. Congratulations, you're now broke, homeless, jobless, with weak creditworthiness, no connections to local private and public support in Nebraska, needing to somehow acquire food, shelter, and some mechanism of paying for it.