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And when Apple’s owners make their share of that profit through capital gains and dividends, the government will take another cut.

ubernostrum 9y ago
You mean when they pay the capital-gains tax rate, which is much lower than the rate us ordinary mortals pay on our income? The poor oppressed billionaires and even, yes, the mere multi-multi-millionaires, do not have my sympathy. I doubt you're going to change that.
- marcoperaza 9y ago
  Uh, this isn't about sympathy. I'm just pointing out that once you add the levels of taxation, it's about the same as the income tax rate. What looks like favorable treatment is just the government taking multiple cuts of the profits, where for wages it just takes one bigger one.
- valuearb 9y ago
  This isn’t about billionaires. A poor retiree in CA with Apple stock is losing close to 60% of their dividends to taxes: The reason capital gains rates are lower than individual income rates is partial compensation for the effects of inflation. If inflation is 2% per year and your investment increases 20% over 10 years, you lost money but still owe taxes. During high inflationary periods this effect kills the stock market, because taxes make investing becomes a guaranteed loser. The reason dividend rates are so low is that the money has already been taxed multiple times in its way to the shareholder. Foreign, State and Federal Corporate income taxes. Your 20% dividend rate is just the tail end of about 60% in total taxes, including state income taxes too.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - ubernostrum 9y ago
    "A poor retiree in CA" doesn't own AAPL. Not directly, not through a 401(k) or other vehicle. They're living off Social Security payments. And retirement investment vehicles, smartly managed, start moving out of stocks and into less volatile securities as you reach actual retirement. So if that retiree is still in AAPL post-retirement, there are other issues going on.
    - valuearb 9y ago
      Even poor retirees own stocks, and they pay huge tax rates on their dividends. You can’t deny that.

ubernostrum 9y ago

You mean when they pay the capital-gains tax rate, which is much lower than the rate us ordinary mortals pay on our income? The poor oppressed billionaires and even, yes, the mere multi-multi-millionaires, do not have my sympathy. I doubt you're going to change that.

marcoperaza 9y ago
Uh, this isn't about sympathy. I'm just pointing out that once you add the levels of taxation, it's about the same as the income tax rate. What looks like favorable treatment is just the government taking multiple cuts of the profits, where for wages it just takes one bigger one.
valuearb 9y ago
This isn’t about billionaires. A poor retiree in CA with Apple stock is losing close to 60% of their dividends to taxes: The reason capital gains rates are lower than individual income rates is partial compensation for the effects of inflation. If inflation is 2% per year and your investment increases 20% over 10 years, you lost money but still owe taxes. During high inflationary periods this effect kills the stock market, because taxes make investing becomes a guaranteed loser. The reason dividend rates are so low is that the money has already been taxed multiple times in its way to the shareholder. Foreign, State and Federal Corporate income taxes. Your 20% dividend rate is just the tail end of about 60% in total taxes, including state income taxes too.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- ubernostrum 9y ago
  "A poor retiree in CA" doesn't own AAPL. Not directly, not through a 401(k) or other vehicle. They're living off Social Security payments. And retirement investment vehicles, smartly managed, start moving out of stocks and into less volatile securities as you reach actual retirement. So if that retiree is still in AAPL post-retirement, there are other issues going on.
  - valuearb 9y ago
    Even poor retirees own stocks, and they pay huge tax rates on their dividends. You can’t deny that.