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>The problem with taxing the wealthy, is that they generally have an outsized share of the political power. I think that a better solution, from a political and

>The problem with taxing the wealthy, is that they generally have an outsized share of the political power. I think that a better solution, from a political and psychological standpoint, would involve a voluntary system. If just rent could be covered, this would be the equivalent of $12k per year in many parts of the US: By voluntary system you mean the wealthy voluntarily turning over the wealth that they won't let us tax them for? It doesn't make sense.

stcredzero 9y ago
By voluntary system you mean the wealthy voluntarily turning over the wealth that they won't let us tax them for? It doesn't make sense. Many other cultures have a gift economy, where the powerful voluntarily redistribute their wealth in exchange for status. Culture is very powerful, often overpowering pure economics. Warren Buffet and Bill Gates have already pledged huge fractions of their wealth towards the common good. On the other hand, the historical record on politically forcing the wealthy to hand over their wealth also supports the notion of voluntarism. It's the society and culture which are the overarching influences. If we changed the culture such that trusts supporting intentional communities were the way the wealthy could have a meaningful impact and legacy, then we could conceivably house over half of the US in virtually free housing. Arguably, living, thriving creative communities would be far more meaningful than plaques in a museum, park benches, and buildings on a college campus. (Colleges are over-funded and in a bubble as it is.)
- frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
  Yeah but there's no solution in your post. Culture can be powerful but we don't exist in the culture you want and I don't see a good way to get there. Hand waving about voluntarism and a culture shift isn't going to fix anything. Tax the shit out of the rich and make them pay for it.
  - stcredzero 9y ago
    Culture can be powerful but we don't exist in the culture you want and I don't see a good way to get there. We used to exist in a culture where women had no options outside of the home and black people were slaves. Hand waving about voluntarism and a culture shift isn't going to fix anything. Tax the shit out of the rich and make them pay for it. In order to tax the rich heavily, you still need a culture shift here in the US. Wherever such taxation works, there is already a thread of communal culture. In order to achieve the same in the US, you need a cultural shift, and not setting up to do that work and simply saying "tax the shit out of the rich" is the hand waving. You're using a slogan that exploits resentment, not setting up for real change.
- wj 9y ago
  What cultures are those? Honest question.
  - stcredzero 9y ago
    Look up the Wikipedia article for Gift Culture.
    - wj 9y ago
      The examples given are for societies that are both incredibly smaller than the U.S as well as not yet reaching industrialization. I'm not sure they are applicable comparisons.

stcredzero 9y ago

By voluntary system you mean the wealthy voluntarily turning over the wealth that they won't let us tax them for? It doesn't make sense. Many other cultures have a gift economy, where the powerful voluntarily redistribute their wealth in exchange for status. Culture is very powerful, often overpowering pure economics. Warren Buffet and Bill Gates have already pledged huge fractions of their wealth towards the common good. On the other hand, the historical record on politically forcing the wealthy to hand over their wealth also supports the notion of voluntarism. It's the society and culture which are the overarching influences. If we changed the culture such that trusts supporting intentional communities were the way the wealthy could have a meaningful impact and legacy, then we could conceivably house over half of the US in virtually free housing. Arguably, living, thriving creative communities would be far more meaningful than plaques in a museum, park benches, and buildings on a college campus. (Colleges are over-funded and in a bubble as it is.)

frgtpsswrdlame 9y ago
Yeah but there's no solution in your post. Culture can be powerful but we don't exist in the culture you want and I don't see a good way to get there. Hand waving about voluntarism and a culture shift isn't going to fix anything. Tax the shit out of the rich and make them pay for it.
- stcredzero 9y ago
  Culture can be powerful but we don't exist in the culture you want and I don't see a good way to get there. We used to exist in a culture where women had no options outside of the home and black people were slaves. Hand waving about voluntarism and a culture shift isn't going to fix anything. Tax the shit out of the rich and make them pay for it. In order to tax the rich heavily, you still need a culture shift here in the US. Wherever such taxation works, there is already a thread of communal culture. In order to achieve the same in the US, you need a cultural shift, and not setting up to do that work and simply saying "tax the shit out of the rich" is the hand waving. You're using a slogan that exploits resentment, not setting up for real change.
wj 9y ago
What cultures are those? Honest question.
- stcredzero 9y ago
  Look up the Wikipedia article for Gift Culture.
  - wj 9y ago
    The examples given are for societies that are both incredibly smaller than the U.S as well as not yet reaching industrialization. I'm not sure they are applicable comparisons.