9 ms·

Thor Electric Truck Will Probably Beat Tesla’s to Market

108 points by devy 9y ago

atonse 9y ago
Ah the half dozen products I dream of building if I could just fund my bills a year or two. :-) (I'm referring to the fact that the founder is really rich from his family's businesses and has self-funded the whole endeavor)
- cantrip 9y ago
  You dream of building an electric semi truck to beat Tesla to market? If that's in your range I don't think you're currently in the right field, whatever you're doing.
  - atonse 9y ago
    haha no, the article talks about the guy being really rich (from his family's defense electronics business) and funding the whole business out of his pocket. That's what I'm referring to.
- ataturk 9y ago
  Just post them--the idea is the easy part.
jandrese 9y ago
They have 18 people and do custom work on every truck? Beating Tesla to market may be moot if you can only build a dozen of them a year.
- bovermyer 9y ago
  Sounds a lot like a startup. The question is going to be, "will they scale?"
  - peterjlee 9y ago
    Software is relatively easy to scale. Manufacturing small electronic devices can also be scaled by outsourcing to factories in China (even Apple does it). Scaling automotive production seems a lot harder. There aren't a lot of car factories out there waiting for some car company to make an order. Building your own factory can take billions of dollars and years to complete. Even Tesla is struggling with scaling production.
    - digikata 9y ago
      If their modifications work, then couldn't an existing truck manufacturing company purchase them and integrate the tech into their existing line?
      - an_account 9y ago
        It might not be able to mass produce their changes. Vehicles are designed around the production line. Think ikea flat pack furniture vs a custom carved table.
        digikata 9y ago
        That's what hardware "design for manufacture" product stages are all about. But no one puts money into that unless there's some knowable value in putting forth that effort. So if a startup proves the value, then a vehicle manufacturer could be willing to do that redesign and integration.
    - maxxxxx 9y ago
      Production is not even the biggest problem. You also need nationwide maintenance and parts supply networks. That's the big advantage of the established manufacturers. They already have these networks in place. It always amazes that I can get almost any part the next day when I go to a dealer.
Animats 9y ago
This makes sense. Electric delivery trucks have been available for decades. Battery powered "milk floats" used to be big in the UK. UPS and the USPS may go for this. Both use their own semi-custom vehicles, and those vehicles spend much of their time stationary while the driver gets out and delivers. UPS is already doing that, but not with these guys.[1] There are other electric van startups, but they have bullshit no-shipping-product startup sites.[2][3] The real player seems to be Damlier, which is electrifying the Mercedes line of vans.[3] [1] https://electrek.co/2017/11/10/ups-converting-battery-electric-delivery-trucks-new-york/ https://electrek.co/2017/11/10/ups-converting-battery-electr... [2] http://www.chanje.us/vehicles http://www.chanje.us/vehicles [3] http://fortune.com/2017/11/20/mercedes-benz-vans-electric-daimler/ http://fortune.com/2017/11/20/mercedes-benz-vans-electric-da... [3] http://workhorse.com/ http://workhorse.com/
- leggomylibro 9y ago
  >Battery powered "milk floats" used to be big in the UK. Oh right, like the Hammerhead Eagle i-Thrust, aka Geoff. I guess EVs have probably come a long ways since then.
- sveme 9y ago
  Another competitor, whose vans are already populating the streets, is Streetscooter [1]. But their marketing seems to be lacking in comparison to their American counterparts. [1] https://www.streetscooter.eu/en/ https://www.streetscooter.eu/en/
  - gruturo 9y ago
    They don't need much marketing. They were, AFAIK, created by DHL for its own needs. DHL approached companies and universities, offered to pay even for the development, but found nobody willing to build what they wanted. They ended up making it by themselves - this is the company created for this purpose. They already have a customer, they were born with it
- raisedbyninjas 9y ago
  USPS should be replacing their trucks. They're all a minimum of 20 years old and get 10 mpg.
abakker 9y ago
Not to be confused with Thor Industries - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thor_Industries https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thor_Industries which manufactures RVs and motor coaches.
- IncRnd 9y ago
  Having owned a very cost effective and enjoyable Thor, I thought the same thing when I saw the headline. Thank you for the reminder.
jpm_sd 9y ago
The photo of a single lithium-ion cell getting a tab spot-welded on by hand is worrisome. That is very-early-prototype stage kind of stuff. If they want to "beat Tesla to market" they should have a fully automated battery production line by now.
- dragontamer 9y ago
  Like Tesla's "fully automated" hand-crafted Model 3 line? https://www.wsj.com/articles/behind-teslas-production-delays-parts-of-model-3-were-being-made-by-hand-1507321057 https://www.wsj.com/articles/behind-teslas-production-delays...
  - jpm_sd 9y ago
    "Hand-crafted" body welding is VERY different from hand-crafting a truck-sized battery pack that contains thousands of small cylindrical cells. The Tesla battery design has used automated cell welding for many years now.
- bpatel576 9y ago
  It looks more like a photo piece than anything else. I'm not sure why they chose to use that in the photo op, but I highly doubt they're creating their own batteries this way.
- tootie 9y ago
  Like my kids always remind me, first is the worst. Second is the best. Third is the one with the hairy chest.
ProfessorLayton 9y ago
Semis are incredibly damaging to roads, they cause 1,400x more wear than cars! [1] It seems that with current battery technology, electric semis' average weight is going to increase drastically, even if they remain within the allowable GVW limit. For example, a Model S weighs more than a Honda Pilot, due to the 1,200lb battery [2]! . Without the diesel tax, we're going to have to figure out another way to pay for road usage. Right now semis are heavily subsidized by everyone else (They're certainly not paying 1,400x more in fuel tax). And I suppose it would be unfair to continue to subsidize diesel, and not electric. However, as our infrastructure decays we're going to have to figure this out. [1] https://www.lrrb.org/pdf/201432.pdf https://www.lrrb.org/pdf/201432.pdf [2] http://www.roperld.com/science/teslamodels.htm http://www.roperld.com/science/teslamodels.htm
- r00fus 9y ago
  How do you compare the roadwear problem to the one of massive pollution caused by burning millions of gallons of petroleum every year to move these vehicles around? I'm not sure a Model S is in the same category of vehicle as a Honda Pilot. What point are you trying to make? Agreed that funding the roadways should be a topic of discussion (also because it's private contractors - often with connections to those authorizing public funds).
  - IgorPartola 9y ago
    That’s the point. Honda Pilot is an 8 passenger SUV. A much less capable car, the model S weighs as much as the Pilot. So if Tesla were to make an 8 passenger hauler, that car would weigh, what, double the size of the Pilot?
    - r00fus 9y ago
      Do people buy Model S vehicles to haul stuff. More to the point, how many Pilots are on the road fully loaded? My guess? Most people buy both cars to haul 1 person a very few miles almost every day. Again, presenting data to make a point that lacks context only detracts from your argument.
Tohan 9y ago
VICTORIA FINANCIER HELP MY FAMILY WITH LOAN @ 2% INTEREST RATE with victoriafinancier@outlook.com VICTORIA FINANCIER COMPANY, offers all kind of loan, ranging from $5,000 USD to $100,000,000.00USD Max. if you need a loan amount quickly write to her Email now with ( victoriafinancier@outlook.com) . She helped me when i was so much in need of money. I lost my job. i and my kids were almost evicted from our house. I seeks assistance from all the people that i know but i could not even get drugs for my child. I also develop brain tumor as a result of stress and excess thinking. In my messed life, i look online for assistance there i found Mrs Victoria Financier Loan Lending company. I read how she always help different people from different countries. I urgently contact her, explain my situations to her same day and then i ask for any assistance that can give because i don't want my kids trow out to street; She advised me to get a loan amount with long term of 10years. I follow her advice, insure my loan amount of $18,000.00USD that i borrowed. The funds was sent into my bank account 4 days of contacting her and she also send the transfer confirmation slip to me and my bank gave me the money in full when i went to withdraw. Victoria Financier service is so amazing. I recommend Victoria Financier Lending Company to you, contact her today and be patient with to assist you because lot's of person contact her daily for assistance. She will help you urgently. Her Email is: victoriafinancier@outlook.com Full Name:_________ Address:_________ Tell:_________ loan amount:_________ Loan duration:_________ Country:_________ Purpose of loan:_________ Monthly Income:__________ Occupation__________ Next of kin:_________ *Email :_________
thisisit 9y ago
I wonder, if there has been a discussion on serviceability of these trucks because that is one of the major selling points. > but dramatic advances in battery technology, electric motors, and control software have made electric trucks more practical. So, if someone wants to learn more about the battery technology and control softwares, where to start?
slivym 9y ago
These guys are not doing what Tesla are doing. Tesla as a company is focused on building a manufacturing plant that is capable of producing Electric Semi Trucks. That's what they're working on. Electric Trucks is the product of the thing they're working on. These guys are working on making Electric Trucks. The more apt comparison is that these guys are competing with the robots that will go in Musk's factory.

108 points by devy 9y ago

Ah the half dozen products I dream of building if I could just fund my bills a year or two. :-) (I'm referring to the fact that the founder is really rich from his family's businesses and has self-funded the whole endeavor)

cantrip 9y ago
You dream of building an electric semi truck to beat Tesla to market? If that's in your range I don't think you're currently in the right field, whatever you're doing.
- atonse 9y ago
  haha no, the article talks about the guy being really rich (from his family's defense electronics business) and funding the whole business out of his pocket. That's what I'm referring to.
ataturk 9y ago
Just post them--the idea is the easy part.

jandrese 9y ago

They have 18 people and do custom work on every truck? Beating Tesla to market may be moot if you can only build a dozen of them a year.

bovermyer 9y ago
Sounds a lot like a startup. The question is going to be, "will they scale?"
- peterjlee 9y ago
  Software is relatively easy to scale. Manufacturing small electronic devices can also be scaled by outsourcing to factories in China (even Apple does it). Scaling automotive production seems a lot harder. There aren't a lot of car factories out there waiting for some car company to make an order. Building your own factory can take billions of dollars and years to complete. Even Tesla is struggling with scaling production.
  - digikata 9y ago
    If their modifications work, then couldn't an existing truck manufacturing company purchase them and integrate the tech into their existing line?
    - an_account 9y ago
      It might not be able to mass produce their changes. Vehicles are designed around the production line. Think ikea flat pack furniture vs a custom carved table.
      - digikata 9y ago
        That's what hardware "design for manufacture" product stages are all about. But no one puts money into that unless there's some knowable value in putting forth that effort. So if a startup proves the value, then a vehicle manufacturer could be willing to do that redesign and integration.
  - maxxxxx 9y ago
    Production is not even the biggest problem. You also need nationwide maintenance and parts supply networks. That's the big advantage of the established manufacturers. They already have these networks in place. It always amazes that I can get almost any part the next day when I go to a dealer.

Animats 9y ago

This makes sense. Electric delivery trucks have been available for decades. Battery powered "milk floats" used to be big in the UK. UPS and the USPS may go for this. Both use their own semi-custom vehicles, and those vehicles spend much of their time stationary while the driver gets out and delivers. UPS is already doing that, but not with these guys.[1] There are other electric van startups, but they have bullshit no-shipping-product startup sites.[2][3] The real player seems to be Damlier, which is electrifying the Mercedes line of vans.[3] [1] https://electrek.co/2017/11/10/ups-converting-battery-electric-delivery-trucks-new-york/ https://electrek.co/2017/11/10/ups-converting-battery-electr... [2] http://www.chanje.us/vehicles http://www.chanje.us/vehicles [3] http://fortune.com/2017/11/20/mercedes-benz-vans-electric-daimler/ http://fortune.com/2017/11/20/mercedes-benz-vans-electric-da... [3] http://workhorse.com/ http://workhorse.com/

leggomylibro 9y ago
>Battery powered "milk floats" used to be big in the UK. Oh right, like the Hammerhead Eagle i-Thrust, aka Geoff. I guess EVs have probably come a long ways since then.
sveme 9y ago
Another competitor, whose vans are already populating the streets, is Streetscooter [1]. But their marketing seems to be lacking in comparison to their American counterparts. [1] https://www.streetscooter.eu/en/ https://www.streetscooter.eu/en/
- gruturo 9y ago
  They don't need much marketing. They were, AFAIK, created by DHL for its own needs. DHL approached companies and universities, offered to pay even for the development, but found nobody willing to build what they wanted. They ended up making it by themselves - this is the company created for this purpose. They already have a customer, they were born with it
raisedbyninjas 9y ago
USPS should be replacing their trucks. They're all a minimum of 20 years old and get 10 mpg.

abakker 9y ago

Not to be confused with Thor Industries - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thor_Industries https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thor_Industries which manufactures RVs and motor coaches.

IncRnd 9y ago
Having owned a very cost effective and enjoyable Thor, I thought the same thing when I saw the headline. Thank you for the reminder.

jpm_sd 9y ago

The photo of a single lithium-ion cell getting a tab spot-welded on by hand is worrisome. That is very-early-prototype stage kind of stuff. If they want to "beat Tesla to market" they should have a fully automated battery production line by now.

dragontamer 9y ago
Like Tesla's "fully automated" hand-crafted Model 3 line? https://www.wsj.com/articles/behind-teslas-production-delays-parts-of-model-3-were-being-made-by-hand-1507321057 https://www.wsj.com/articles/behind-teslas-production-delays...
- jpm_sd 9y ago
  "Hand-crafted" body welding is VERY different from hand-crafting a truck-sized battery pack that contains thousands of small cylindrical cells. The Tesla battery design has used automated cell welding for many years now.
bpatel576 9y ago
It looks more like a photo piece than anything else. I'm not sure why they chose to use that in the photo op, but I highly doubt they're creating their own batteries this way.
tootie 9y ago
Like my kids always remind me, first is the worst. Second is the best. Third is the one with the hairy chest.

ProfessorLayton 9y ago

Semis are incredibly damaging to roads, they cause 1,400x more wear than cars! [1] It seems that with current battery technology, electric semis' average weight is going to increase drastically, even if they remain within the allowable GVW limit. For example, a Model S weighs more than a Honda Pilot, due to the 1,200lb battery [2]! . Without the diesel tax, we're going to have to figure out another way to pay for road usage. Right now semis are heavily subsidized by everyone else (They're certainly not paying 1,400x more in fuel tax). And I suppose it would be unfair to continue to subsidize diesel, and not electric. However, as our infrastructure decays we're going to have to figure this out. [1] https://www.lrrb.org/pdf/201432.pdf https://www.lrrb.org/pdf/201432.pdf [2] http://www.roperld.com/science/teslamodels.htm http://www.roperld.com/science/teslamodels.htm

r00fus 9y ago
How do you compare the roadwear problem to the one of massive pollution caused by burning millions of gallons of petroleum every year to move these vehicles around? I'm not sure a Model S is in the same category of vehicle as a Honda Pilot. What point are you trying to make? Agreed that funding the roadways should be a topic of discussion (also because it's private contractors - often with connections to those authorizing public funds).
- IgorPartola 9y ago
  That’s the point. Honda Pilot is an 8 passenger SUV. A much less capable car, the model S weighs as much as the Pilot. So if Tesla were to make an 8 passenger hauler, that car would weigh, what, double the size of the Pilot?
  - r00fus 9y ago
    Do people buy Model S vehicles to haul stuff. More to the point, how many Pilots are on the road fully loaded? My guess? Most people buy both cars to haul 1 person a very few miles almost every day. Again, presenting data to make a point that lacks context only detracts from your argument.

Tohan 9y ago

VICTORIA FINANCIER HELP MY FAMILY WITH LOAN @ 2% INTEREST RATE with victoriafinancier@outlook.com VICTORIA FINANCIER COMPANY, offers all kind of loan, ranging from $5,000 USD to $100,000,000.00USD Max. if you need a loan amount quickly write to her Email now with ( victoriafinancier@outlook.com) . She helped me when i was so much in need of money. I lost my job. i and my kids were almost evicted from our house. I seeks assistance from all the people that i know but i could not even get drugs for my child. I also develop brain tumor as a result of stress and excess thinking. In my messed life, i look online for assistance there i found Mrs Victoria Financier Loan Lending company. I read how she always help different people from different countries. I urgently contact her, explain my situations to her same day and then i ask for any assistance that can give because i don't want my kids trow out to street; She advised me to get a loan amount with long term of 10years. I follow her advice, insure my loan amount of $18,000.00USD that i borrowed. The funds was sent into my bank account 4 days of contacting her and she also send the transfer confirmation slip to me and my bank gave me the money in full when i went to withdraw. Victoria Financier service is so amazing. I recommend Victoria Financier Lending Company to you, contact her today and be patient with to assist you because lot's of person contact her daily for assistance. She will help you urgently. Her Email is: victoriafinancier@outlook.com Full Name:_________ Address:_________ Tell:_________ loan amount:_________ Loan duration:_________ Country:_________ Purpose of loan:_________ Monthly Income:__________ Occupation__________ Next of kin:_________ *Email :_________

thisisit 9y ago

I wonder, if there has been a discussion on serviceability of these trucks because that is one of the major selling points. > but dramatic advances in battery technology, electric motors, and control software have made electric trucks more practical. So, if someone wants to learn more about the battery technology and control softwares, where to start?

slivym 9y ago

These guys are not doing what Tesla are doing. Tesla as a company is focused on building a manufacturing plant that is capable of producing Electric Semi Trucks. That's what they're working on. Electric Trucks is the product of the thing they're working on. These guys are working on making Electric Trucks. The more apt comparison is that these guys are competing with the robots that will go in Musk's factory.