3 ms·

I don't think it's possible to know. There are so many cultural factors that led to where we are today that it's all but impossible to draw a straight line. No

by untog 9y ago

I don't think it's possible to know. There are so many cultural factors that led to where we are today that it's all but impossible to draw a straight line. No doubt Susan Fowler had an effect on that culture. So did the first female Presidential nominee losing to an incredibly unqualified man (before anyone starts, no, I'm not saying that sexism is the only reason she lost), as did the fact that Trump himself had numerous accusations against him that were all but dismissed in popular consciousness... I don't mean to diminish Fowler at all. But the moment we have arrived at is a huge collection of interconnected events, not a straight line from A, through B, to C.

aaron-lebo 9y ago
I wonder if Clinton didn't have certain associations - Bill, Weiner, Weinstein (the Clintons were warned about him and met with him after the election to make a show about the campaign, only to later feign shock and distance themselves), would those accusations against Trump have had more power? I know that's not your main point, it's just important to point out culpable people like the Clintons were instead of seeing them (or the campaign) as victims. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/12/05/us/harvey-weinstein-complicity.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/12/05/us/harvey-wei... In late September, emails show, he was discussing a documentary television show he was working on with Hillary Clinton. He had long raised campaign cash for her, and her feminist credentials helped burnish his image — even though Tina Brown, the magazine editor, and Lena Dunham, the writer and actress, each say they had cautioned Mrs. Clinton’s aides about his treatment of women. Now, Mr. Weinstein exchanged questions about distribution rights for the show. “I am hopeful we can get a good price for this,” Robert Barnett, Mrs. Clinton’s lawyer, replied. Two days later, Jeff Bezos, founder and chief executive of Amazon, interrupted a vacation in Hawaii to field advice from Mr. Weinstein, according to the emails. The Wall Street Journal was reporting on turmoil at Amazon Studios, one of Mr. Weinstein’s business partners. He recommended an aggressive response that involved hiring some of his own team, including a libel lawyer who “makes sure everyone sticks to the right narrative,” Mr. Weinstein wrote. He added, “I’m happy to coordinate with whoever you’d like, as a friend of the court.” Mr. Bezos declined to comment.
- untog 9y ago
  My instinct is no - I don't think the allegations against Trump fell away because Hillary was compromised over them, I think they failed because, well, not enough voters cared. Which is part of what inspired the Women's March and so on. That said, it's a fascinating thought exercise to wonder where President Clinton would be today, if the same sexual assault revelations happened. As the first female President married to someone accused of various sexual improprieties I suspect it would be a very difficult needle to thread.

by untog 9y ago

aaron-lebo 9y ago

I wonder if Clinton didn't have certain associations - Bill, Weiner, Weinstein (the Clintons were warned about him and met with him after the election to make a show about the campaign, only to later feign shock and distance themselves), would those accusations against Trump have had more power? I know that's not your main point, it's just important to point out culpable people like the Clintons were instead of seeing them (or the campaign) as victims. https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/12/05/us/harvey-weinstein-complicity.html https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2017/12/05/us/harvey-wei... In late September, emails show, he was discussing a documentary television show he was working on with Hillary Clinton. He had long raised campaign cash for her, and her feminist credentials helped burnish his image — even though Tina Brown, the magazine editor, and Lena Dunham, the writer and actress, each say they had cautioned Mrs. Clinton’s aides about his treatment of women. Now, Mr. Weinstein exchanged questions about distribution rights for the show. “I am hopeful we can get a good price for this,” Robert Barnett, Mrs. Clinton’s lawyer, replied. Two days later, Jeff Bezos, founder and chief executive of Amazon, interrupted a vacation in Hawaii to field advice from Mr. Weinstein, according to the emails. The Wall Street Journal was reporting on turmoil at Amazon Studios, one of Mr. Weinstein’s business partners. He recommended an aggressive response that involved hiring some of his own team, including a libel lawyer who “makes sure everyone sticks to the right narrative,” Mr. Weinstein wrote. He added, “I’m happy to coordinate with whoever you’d like, as a friend of the court.” Mr. Bezos declined to comment.

untog 9y ago
My instinct is no - I don't think the allegations against Trump fell away because Hillary was compromised over them, I think they failed because, well, not enough voters cared. Which is part of what inspired the Women's March and so on. That said, it's a fascinating thought exercise to wonder where President Clinton would be today, if the same sexual assault revelations happened. As the first female President married to someone accused of various sexual improprieties I suspect it would be a very difficult needle to thread.