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I'm far from an expert, but my understanding was that those kinds of adversarial attacks would be prohibitively difficult without full access to the learning sy

I'm far from an expert, but my understanding was that those kinds of adversarial attacks would be prohibitively difficult without full access to the learning system used by that product. If so, there's a vector if you can hack the company and train your own model to generate the adversarial examples to fool it, but it's not a trivial thing

chillingeffect 9y ago
I think the so-called carousel attack would apply. Assuming the penalties for bringing in a gun are low, "oops, I forget, sorry," all you need to do is send in a train of people with different types of attacks and note which make it through.
- LyndsySimon 9y ago
  > Assuming the penalties for bringing in a gun are low A quick check (ETA: of Nevada law) shows that "gunbuster" signs don't have force of law. Assuming you leave if and when asked, there's absolutely no legal repercussion to ignoring them.
  - wl 9y ago
    This varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction. It's a crime in Texas for a licensed concealed carrier to carry a gun onto property where there are signs prohibiting the carry of guns. http://codes.findlaw.com/tx/penal-code/penal-sect-30-06.html http://codes.findlaw.com/tx/penal-code/penal-sect-30-06.html
    - LyndsySimon 9y ago
      Of course - I should have specified, I checked Nevada law. That said, Texas law requires very, very specific signage. The last time I was in Austin I saw lots of them, but none that met the legal requirements.
      - tombrossman 9y ago
        > That said, Texas law requires very, very specific signage. Exactly right. The amateur signs you see are almost a running joke, to intimidate new CCW permit holders. Here's the full description of what standards a sign must meet to be enforceable: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_Texas#30.06_signage https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_Texas#30.06_signag... Bonus, you can carry without a permit, as long as you claim you were 'travelling', and the burden of proof is on the cops to dispute it: http://www.dallasobserver.com/news/texas-concealed-gun-laws-loosen-6419621 http://www.dallasobserver.com/news/texas-concealed-gun-laws-... (this law may have changed by now, but it was widely known when I lived there).
      - drunken-serval 9y ago
        It's the same in Ohio. Most buildings that ban guns don't have the proper signage.

chillingeffect 9y ago

I think the so-called carousel attack would apply. Assuming the penalties for bringing in a gun are low, "oops, I forget, sorry," all you need to do is send in a train of people with different types of attacks and note which make it through.

LyndsySimon 9y ago
> Assuming the penalties for bringing in a gun are low A quick check (ETA: of Nevada law) shows that "gunbuster" signs don't have force of law. Assuming you leave if and when asked, there's absolutely no legal repercussion to ignoring them.
- wl 9y ago
  This varies from jurisdiction to jurisdiction. It's a crime in Texas for a licensed concealed carrier to carry a gun onto property where there are signs prohibiting the carry of guns. http://codes.findlaw.com/tx/penal-code/penal-sect-30-06.html http://codes.findlaw.com/tx/penal-code/penal-sect-30-06.html
  - LyndsySimon 9y ago
    Of course - I should have specified, I checked Nevada law. That said, Texas law requires very, very specific signage. The last time I was in Austin I saw lots of them, but none that met the legal requirements.
    - tombrossman 9y ago
      > That said, Texas law requires very, very specific signage. Exactly right. The amateur signs you see are almost a running joke, to intimidate new CCW permit holders. Here's the full description of what standards a sign must meet to be enforceable: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_Texas#30.06_signage https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun_laws_in_Texas#30.06_signag... Bonus, you can carry without a permit, as long as you claim you were 'travelling', and the burden of proof is on the cops to dispute it: http://www.dallasobserver.com/news/texas-concealed-gun-laws-loosen-6419621 http://www.dallasobserver.com/news/texas-concealed-gun-laws-... (this law may have changed by now, but it was widely known when I lived there).
    - drunken-serval 9y ago
      It's the same in Ohio. Most buildings that ban guns don't have the proper signage.