6 ms·

I'm a private citizen. In most states if I'm in a confrontation with someone I'll need more of a credible threat than a man on the ground touching his hip to sh

I'm a private citizen. In most states if I'm in a confrontation with someone I'll need more of a credible threat than a man on the ground touching his hip to shoot him. Why should a police officer be held to a lower standard?

zaarn 9y ago
I'm not suggesting that police officers are held to lower standards, quite the opposite. But please recognize that this wasn't some everyday situation in which someone touched their hip, rather, the police was under the believe someone in the building was armed and dangerous, which is quite a different situation.
- sametmax 9y ago
  It's so weird. In france if somebody reach for his pocket most people would never think 'gun'. The US appear in a scary light when I read that.
  - zaarn 9y ago
    As someone living in germany, I agree. Police in the USA seems to be undertrained, underpaid and aggressive beyond reasonable. As I've mentioned in the past, I feel lucky I don't have to live in the US, it seems to be a terrible place to be.
    - jaccarmac 9y ago
      Before this case I would have told you that as long as you were like me (white, male, relatively well-off) it's a fine place. This year I'm not so certain.
    - dagw 9y ago
      Police in the USA seems to be undertrained The problem isn't lack of training, it's the way they're being trained.
  - jaccarmac 9y ago
    To a certain degree it's because of the gun culture in the US. But I support gun rights, enjoy sport shooting, and also would not immediately think "gun". My hypothesis is that police work in the States tends to attract the kind of people who want to be macho and point guns at people but lack the cajones to join the military and actually have those people want to kill them back. This obviously doesn't describe all or even most officers, but I've met enough kids like that in my high school years who dreamed of heading to the police academy that I believe it's significant.
    - sametmax 9y ago
      I enjoy going to the shooting range myself. But here if you want to have the right to hold something else than a 9mm in a secured and monitored location you have to work a lot for it, and prove you are not going to go booling for columbine. A country where sometimes kids can have a hold on an automatic doesn't feel right to me.
      - jaccarmac 9y ago
        > A country where sometimes kids can have a hold on an automatic Citation needed? That isn't a likely situation outside a carefully monitored range with waivers, etc. signed.
        sametmax 9y ago
        https://qz.com/37015/how-school-killings-in-the-us-stack-up-against-36-other-countries-put-together/ https://qz.com/37015/how-school-killings-in-the-us-stack-up-...
        CompanionCuuube 9y ago
        They don't. Automatic weapons are pricey, heavily controlled and not something people are likely to pick up at a retail store or even a gun show.
- jaccarmac 9y ago
  If the standard isn't lower, where is the evidence for the officer's claim that he was 100% certain the victim was armed? The bodycam footage certainly doesn't seem to back up that kind of claim...

zaarn 9y ago

I'm not suggesting that police officers are held to lower standards, quite the opposite. But please recognize that this wasn't some everyday situation in which someone touched their hip, rather, the police was under the believe someone in the building was armed and dangerous, which is quite a different situation.

sametmax 9y ago
It's so weird. In france if somebody reach for his pocket most people would never think 'gun'. The US appear in a scary light when I read that.
- zaarn 9y ago
  As someone living in germany, I agree. Police in the USA seems to be undertrained, underpaid and aggressive beyond reasonable. As I've mentioned in the past, I feel lucky I don't have to live in the US, it seems to be a terrible place to be.
  - jaccarmac 9y ago
    Before this case I would have told you that as long as you were like me (white, male, relatively well-off) it's a fine place. This year I'm not so certain.
  - dagw 9y ago
    Police in the USA seems to be undertrained The problem isn't lack of training, it's the way they're being trained.
- jaccarmac 9y ago
  To a certain degree it's because of the gun culture in the US. But I support gun rights, enjoy sport shooting, and also would not immediately think "gun". My hypothesis is that police work in the States tends to attract the kind of people who want to be macho and point guns at people but lack the cajones to join the military and actually have those people want to kill them back. This obviously doesn't describe all or even most officers, but I've met enough kids like that in my high school years who dreamed of heading to the police academy that I believe it's significant.
  - sametmax 9y ago
    I enjoy going to the shooting range myself. But here if you want to have the right to hold something else than a 9mm in a secured and monitored location you have to work a lot for it, and prove you are not going to go booling for columbine. A country where sometimes kids can have a hold on an automatic doesn't feel right to me.
    - jaccarmac 9y ago
      > A country where sometimes kids can have a hold on an automatic Citation needed? That isn't a likely situation outside a carefully monitored range with waivers, etc. signed.
      - sametmax 9y ago
        https://qz.com/37015/how-school-killings-in-the-us-stack-up-against-36-other-countries-put-together/ https://qz.com/37015/how-school-killings-in-the-us-stack-up-...
      - CompanionCuuube 9y ago
        They don't. Automatic weapons are pricey, heavily controlled and not something people are likely to pick up at a retail store or even a gun show.
jaccarmac 9y ago
If the standard isn't lower, where is the evidence for the officer's claim that he was 100% certain the victim was armed? The bodycam footage certainly doesn't seem to back up that kind of claim...