5 ms·

You might look at Red Hat's OpenShift, which builds on top of Kubernetes. Or Deis, which has adopted buildpacks. Cloud Foundry has buildpacks too, but it's usu

You might look at Red Hat's OpenShift, which builds on top of Kubernetes. Or Deis, which has adopted buildpacks. Cloud Foundry has buildpacks too, but it's usually seen as a heavyweight solution -- the light footprint variant is 6 VMs, the standard variant is 20-something. Disclosure: I work for Pivotal, we contribute a lot to Cloud Foundry. Red Hat is a competitor.

StavrosK 9y ago
Ah, I've heard about Deis, I'll check that one out, thanks. My main concern is the fact that Kubernetes recommends running more than one server, which is a luxury my personal projects cannot afford. Does anyone know how well it runs on a single server?
- jacques_chester 9y ago
  There's minikube, but so far as I'm aware, it's not really meant for production use; it exists mostly for local development. My own company has Pivotal Web Services[0], which gives a Heroku-like experience using Cloud Foundry. Pricing is per-megabyte[1], plus services. I expect we'll introduce a container service before long, because we like to dogfood our stuff with real production workloads. [0] http://run.pivotal.io/ http://run.pivotal.io/ [1] http://run.pivotal.io/pricing/ http://run.pivotal.io/pricing/
  - StavrosK 9y ago
    Yeah, minikube is just for trying K8s out. PWS looks interesting, but, as with other managed/cloud offerings, it's much more expensive than a dedicated server (50ish EUR/mo for a 64 GB RAM i7). For my side-projects, where I am cost-sensitive, I think the best solution would be a dedicated server with something like Dokku. It would just be nice if the "something" could be an industry standard.
    - jacques_chester 9y ago
      I think it's hard to split the difference. If there was a service using RackHD to spit out cheap bare metal it'd be more doable to run on top of that, I think.
- ianburrell 9y ago
  It is possible to run Kubernetes on a single machine combining master and worker nodes but there are few instructions for it. Really only makes sense for single bare metal machine. For production, better to run separate VMs. The hosted Kubernetes, GKE and Azure, can run clusters without paying for master nodes and can have pretty small nodes.
- ryanl-ee 9y ago
  It's easy enough to set that up (though it's not the recommended use case) using kubeadm.
- yebyen 9y ago
  I use Deis on a single server. It works great. There are a few things you need to be aware of, but the tl;dr is that it works great for us. We'd be using it more, except that our org hasn't adopted containers in any meaningful way yet, and Deis is large and complicated, and a little too much for them to bite off and swallow all at once. They want to do a pilot on ECS so that we can say we're using more AWS services (yay lock-in, we love vendor lock-in.) So, those things you need to be aware of: #1 - In the default mode, Minio is used instead of a real Object Storage backend like S3 or Swift, and Minio is configured to keep all objects in RAM by default. Use S3 instead. This is an option to configure in values.yaml. #2 - builder really needs to be on an SSD, but if you're not backing your Kube node with SSD, you can at least prevent a lot of builder crashes by making sure there isn't much swap to fill and bog down the disk with swapped pages. This may be counter-intuitive (don't things crash when they run out of RAM? Isn't that why you have swap...) until you realize that Builder has to respond to health checks by default once per second. So if the node that builder runs on is getting even remotely bogged down by swappiness and lots of swappy pages, it will be killed and restarted, which takes some time and is noticeable and annoying. #3 - The remaining cloud services that Deis can optionally depend on IMHO are take-or-leave, depending on your cloud provider. Deis can do everything in-cluster. I actually use this configuration with Minikube and Deis, and it works great. I let Deis spin up its Postgres database on-cluster and restore from S3 WAL backups each day, it just works. I'd be using Deis more heavily, except that my app development has a production database attached. (Our infosec department is leary about letting me put backups of sensitive data into S3. So we really have to use RDS for our app, even though Deis is creating a Postgres database that nothing else is stopping you from using with your app. It's for Deis controller operation though.) #4 - This one may be a dealbreaker if your company is very serious, Deis is now "End-of-Life." This means that Microsoft has committed to provide break fixes for Deis until March only, and by middle of next year, any break fixes will have to come from the community. There is AFAIK nowhere to buy Deis support, although there is a new group that has formed to commit to support Deis into the future, it's not clear what form that support will take, or whether you'll be able to pay money for an SLA, or anything like that. It is open-source. This may be exactly what you'd prefer, or it may be a deal breaker. I like Open Source, but my group likes support. I do not work for Deis or any other cloud PaaS provider, although I have evaluated a lot of them including OpenShift (and I consider Deis to be technologically superior in some ways to OpenShift.) Because of my ECS requirement, I'm looking at Convox now. If you have to use ECS, so far I would definitely recommend Convox. If you're like the rest of the world and using K8S, I can't think of any really good reason not to recommend Deis.
dmacvicar 9y ago
SUSE's Cloud Application Platform is already available to selected customers. It is based Cloud Foundry running on top of Kubernetes, all with a very slick UI. No VMs. https://www.suse.com/products/cloud-application-platform/ https://www.suse.com/products/cloud-application-platform/ https://www.suse.com/communities/blog/take-look-suse-cloud-application-platform-see/ https://www.suse.com/communities/blog/take-look-suse-cloud-a... I tried it recently with an internal app, and the experience was very similar to Heroku. cf push and my app was running. Disclosure: I work for SUSE, we contribute to Cloud Foundry and the containers ecosystem. Pivotal is a competitor.
- dmacvicar 9y ago
  btw, here is an article about the management UI: https://www.suse.com/communities/blog/introducing-stratos-ui-open-source-management-ui-cloud-foundry/ https://www.suse.com/communities/blog/introducing-stratos-ui...
- jacques_chester 9y ago
  I am actually super pleased that SUSE have picked up where HPE left off. I am hopeful it will avoid too many distro-level monoculturisms. The link to the UI blog post has turned up in our private chat channels :)

StavrosK 9y ago

Ah, I've heard about Deis, I'll check that one out, thanks. My main concern is the fact that Kubernetes recommends running more than one server, which is a luxury my personal projects cannot afford. Does anyone know how well it runs on a single server?

jacques_chester 9y ago
There's minikube, but so far as I'm aware, it's not really meant for production use; it exists mostly for local development. My own company has Pivotal Web Services[0], which gives a Heroku-like experience using Cloud Foundry. Pricing is per-megabyte[1], plus services. I expect we'll introduce a container service before long, because we like to dogfood our stuff with real production workloads. [0] http://run.pivotal.io/ http://run.pivotal.io/ [1] http://run.pivotal.io/pricing/ http://run.pivotal.io/pricing/
- StavrosK 9y ago
  Yeah, minikube is just for trying K8s out. PWS looks interesting, but, as with other managed/cloud offerings, it's much more expensive than a dedicated server (50ish EUR/mo for a 64 GB RAM i7). For my side-projects, where I am cost-sensitive, I think the best solution would be a dedicated server with something like Dokku. It would just be nice if the "something" could be an industry standard.
  - jacques_chester 9y ago
    I think it's hard to split the difference. If there was a service using RackHD to spit out cheap bare metal it'd be more doable to run on top of that, I think.
ianburrell 9y ago
It is possible to run Kubernetes on a single machine combining master and worker nodes but there are few instructions for it. Really only makes sense for single bare metal machine. For production, better to run separate VMs. The hosted Kubernetes, GKE and Azure, can run clusters without paying for master nodes and can have pretty small nodes.
ryanl-ee 9y ago
It's easy enough to set that up (though it's not the recommended use case) using kubeadm.
yebyen 9y ago
I use Deis on a single server. It works great. There are a few things you need to be aware of, but the tl;dr is that it works great for us. We'd be using it more, except that our org hasn't adopted containers in any meaningful way yet, and Deis is large and complicated, and a little too much for them to bite off and swallow all at once. They want to do a pilot on ECS so that we can say we're using more AWS services (yay lock-in, we love vendor lock-in.) So, those things you need to be aware of: #1 - In the default mode, Minio is used instead of a real Object Storage backend like S3 or Swift, and Minio is configured to keep all objects in RAM by default. Use S3 instead. This is an option to configure in values.yaml. #2 - builder really needs to be on an SSD, but if you're not backing your Kube node with SSD, you can at least prevent a lot of builder crashes by making sure there isn't much swap to fill and bog down the disk with swapped pages. This may be counter-intuitive (don't things crash when they run out of RAM? Isn't that why you have swap...) until you realize that Builder has to respond to health checks by default once per second. So if the node that builder runs on is getting even remotely bogged down by swappiness and lots of swappy pages, it will be killed and restarted, which takes some time and is noticeable and annoying. #3 - The remaining cloud services that Deis can optionally depend on IMHO are take-or-leave, depending on your cloud provider. Deis can do everything in-cluster. I actually use this configuration with Minikube and Deis, and it works great. I let Deis spin up its Postgres database on-cluster and restore from S3 WAL backups each day, it just works. I'd be using Deis more heavily, except that my app development has a production database attached. (Our infosec department is leary about letting me put backups of sensitive data into S3. So we really have to use RDS for our app, even though Deis is creating a Postgres database that nothing else is stopping you from using with your app. It's for Deis controller operation though.) #4 - This one may be a dealbreaker if your company is very serious, Deis is now "End-of-Life." This means that Microsoft has committed to provide break fixes for Deis until March only, and by middle of next year, any break fixes will have to come from the community. There is AFAIK nowhere to buy Deis support, although there is a new group that has formed to commit to support Deis into the future, it's not clear what form that support will take, or whether you'll be able to pay money for an SLA, or anything like that. It is open-source. This may be exactly what you'd prefer, or it may be a deal breaker. I like Open Source, but my group likes support. I do not work for Deis or any other cloud PaaS provider, although I have evaluated a lot of them including OpenShift (and I consider Deis to be technologically superior in some ways to OpenShift.) Because of my ECS requirement, I'm looking at Convox now. If you have to use ECS, so far I would definitely recommend Convox. If you're like the rest of the world and using K8S, I can't think of any really good reason not to recommend Deis.

dmacvicar 9y ago

SUSE's Cloud Application Platform is already available to selected customers. It is based Cloud Foundry running on top of Kubernetes, all with a very slick UI. No VMs. https://www.suse.com/products/cloud-application-platform/ https://www.suse.com/products/cloud-application-platform/ https://www.suse.com/communities/blog/take-look-suse-cloud-application-platform-see/ https://www.suse.com/communities/blog/take-look-suse-cloud-a... I tried it recently with an internal app, and the experience was very similar to Heroku. cf push and my app was running. Disclosure: I work for SUSE, we contribute to Cloud Foundry and the containers ecosystem. Pivotal is a competitor.

dmacvicar 9y ago
btw, here is an article about the management UI: https://www.suse.com/communities/blog/introducing-stratos-ui-open-source-management-ui-cloud-foundry/ https://www.suse.com/communities/blog/introducing-stratos-ui...
jacques_chester 9y ago
I am actually super pleased that SUSE have picked up where HPE left off. I am hopeful it will avoid too many distro-level monoculturisms. The link to the UI blog post has turned up in our private chat channels :)