3 ms·

I would be interested to know what is the cost of that electricity per bitcoin transacted. Credit card processing fees are a small number of percent, AIUI. Is

by tome 9y ago

I would be interested to know what is the cost of that electricity per bitcoin transacted. Credit card processing fees are a small number of percent, AIUI. Is it comparable?

carlmr 9y ago
Currently it stands at 250kWh per transaction. My two person household in a developed country with lots of appliances uses 6 Bitcoin transactions per year in electricity. Bitcoin eletricity uses is insanity and it's only set up to rise. https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-energy-consumption https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-energy-consumption
- tome 9y ago
  Interesting. According to https://www.ukpower.co.uk/home_energy/tariffs-per-unit-kwh https://www.ukpower.co.uk/home_energy/tariffs-per-unit-kwh the price per kWh in the UK is of the order of 10p. So a transaction costs 25 pounds? That surely can't be right.
  - QAPereo 9y ago
    Depends on how/when you're getting/spending your electricity. If you're just running your mining operation out of your home, during daylight hours then you'd probably be about right. Presumably mining successfully has a lot to do with getting your electricity at a steep discount. The way we generate electricity, that's entirely possible at certain times. We're not going to stay in that relatively narrow band for long though, with the growth of this thing. There's only so much "spare" on the grid, off-peak, and this whole thing relies on wasteful means of energy production, storage and transmission. So on one hand (hopefully) the opportunity to scavenge for cheap CPU cycles is going to contract, while the market for bitcoin expands? Yikes.
  - rsynnott 9y ago
    Big miners are likely using somewhat cheaper electricity than that, but yeah, the cost of a transaction could well be in that range. The cost of a transaction to a bitcoin _user_ is now significant.
  - eggpy 9y ago
    That is correct on order of magnitude, at least (25 pounds ~ $33 today). That's one of the reasons Steam is no longer accepting bitcoins[0]: > transaction fees that are charged to the customer by the Bitcoin network have skyrocketed this year, topping out at close to $20 a transaction last week (compared to roughly $0.20 when we initially enabled Bitcoin). [0] http://steamcommunity.com/games/593110/announcements/detail/1464096684955433613 http://steamcommunity.com/games/593110/announcements/detail/...
  - nicky0 9y ago
    About right. The block reward more than pays for it.
  - IWeldMelons 9y ago
    In parts of the former USSR, energy costs 1/8 or less of the price in the developed world.
- danieltillett 9y ago
  The sooner this bubble bursts the better. Bitcoin has become an environmental obscenity.
wz1000 9y ago
It is profitable for the entire network to burn upto 12.5*price of bitcoin dollars worth of coal every ~10 minutes. At $15,000 a BTC, that means miners can consume $27,000,000 worth of electricity a day and still remain profitable. This amount varies linearly with the price of BTC.
- PeterisP 9y ago
  As a corollary to this, the cost per transaction also varies linearly with the price of BTC - the more useful BTC becomes for investors/speculators/as a store of value, the less useful it becomes as a tool for transactions. On the other hand, the high valuation can only be justified by the expectation of it being a really good tool for transactions (or, alternatively, the greater fool theory) and becoming bad at transactions means it'll eventually become also a bad store of value; so a technical solution to transaction cost is highly needed.

by tome 9y ago

I would be interested to know what is the cost of that electricity per bitcoin transacted. Credit card processing fees are a small number of percent, AIUI. Is it comparable?

carlmr 9y ago

Currently it stands at 250kWh per transaction. My two person household in a developed country with lots of appliances uses 6 Bitcoin transactions per year in electricity. Bitcoin eletricity uses is insanity and it's only set up to rise. https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-energy-consumption https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-energy-consumption

tome 9y ago
Interesting. According to https://www.ukpower.co.uk/home_energy/tariffs-per-unit-kwh https://www.ukpower.co.uk/home_energy/tariffs-per-unit-kwh the price per kWh in the UK is of the order of 10p. So a transaction costs 25 pounds? That surely can't be right.
- QAPereo 9y ago
  Depends on how/when you're getting/spending your electricity. If you're just running your mining operation out of your home, during daylight hours then you'd probably be about right. Presumably mining successfully has a lot to do with getting your electricity at a steep discount. The way we generate electricity, that's entirely possible at certain times. We're not going to stay in that relatively narrow band for long though, with the growth of this thing. There's only so much "spare" on the grid, off-peak, and this whole thing relies on wasteful means of energy production, storage and transmission. So on one hand (hopefully) the opportunity to scavenge for cheap CPU cycles is going to contract, while the market for bitcoin expands? Yikes.
- rsynnott 9y ago
  Big miners are likely using somewhat cheaper electricity than that, but yeah, the cost of a transaction could well be in that range. The cost of a transaction to a bitcoin _user_ is now significant.
- eggpy 9y ago
  That is correct on order of magnitude, at least (25 pounds ~ $33 today). That's one of the reasons Steam is no longer accepting bitcoins[0]: > transaction fees that are charged to the customer by the Bitcoin network have skyrocketed this year, topping out at close to $20 a transaction last week (compared to roughly $0.20 when we initially enabled Bitcoin). [0] http://steamcommunity.com/games/593110/announcements/detail/1464096684955433613 http://steamcommunity.com/games/593110/announcements/detail/...
- nicky0 9y ago
  About right. The block reward more than pays for it.
- IWeldMelons 9y ago
  In parts of the former USSR, energy costs 1/8 or less of the price in the developed world.
danieltillett 9y ago
The sooner this bubble bursts the better. Bitcoin has become an environmental obscenity.

wz1000 9y ago

It is profitable for the entire network to burn upto 12.5*price of bitcoin dollars worth of coal every ~10 minutes. At $15,000 a BTC, that means miners can consume $27,000,000 worth of electricity a day and still remain profitable. This amount varies linearly with the price of BTC.

PeterisP 9y ago
As a corollary to this, the cost per transaction also varies linearly with the price of BTC - the more useful BTC becomes for investors/speculators/as a store of value, the less useful it becomes as a tool for transactions. On the other hand, the high valuation can only be justified by the expectation of it being a really good tool for transactions (or, alternatively, the greater fool theory) and becoming bad at transactions means it'll eventually become also a bad store of value; so a technical solution to transaction cost is highly needed.