4 ms·

Each Bitcoin transaction uses 100 - 200kwh. It's absurd if you think about it. Isn't this going to be what dooms block chain let alone Bitcoin?

by pcurve 9y ago

nlperguiy 9y ago
Not if it's mining running on solar.
- ajdlinux 9y ago
  I hear this argument from my colleague who runs his mining rigs on a solar PV setup. Given how quickly we as a civilisation need to be moving away from fossil fuels, I don't buy that this is a better use than using your solar PV panels to feed back into the grid and thus reduce demand on non-renewable generators.
  - nlperguiy 9y ago
    The amount of energy used for BTC is nothing compared to energy used for Internet. It's equivalent to 0, compared to usage for heating and cooling.
JauntyHatAngle 9y ago
Not all blockchains use PoW algos, or are decentralised in the bitcoin sense, or use the same hashing tools. Proof of stake is one example of how that doesn't "doom" blockchains.
seibelj 9y ago
It’s not just doing transactions. It’s maintaining $300billion in global wealth and rising every day, without any institutions or government. I’m sure the traditional financial system uses a lot of power as well...
- ajdlinux 9y ago
  The IBM mainframes that run most of the global financial system and maintain a few orders of magnitude more of global wealth are reasonably power hungry, yes, but I don't think the system averages consumption of kilowatt hours of energy every single time I swipe my credit card.
  - seibelj 9y ago
    The act of transferring BTC doesn’t magically cause hundreds of megawatts of power to be wasted. Your transaction happening or not happening doesn’t alter the electrical useage of the system. The system uses electricity to protect itself from being taken over by a malicious actor.
mrb 9y ago
A bitcoin transaction does NOT use mining energy. Transaction rate and energy use are independent. The media always gets this wrong. It's like saying each bit on a CD-ROM "use fuel" when it's shipped on a mail truck.
- rrobukef 9y ago
  But there is a cost for each bit. It's amortized. Because at some point you need a second cd, which increases fuel a tiny bit, and lowers the amirtized cost per bit. At some point you need a bigger truck and then a second truck, suddenly the cost jumps up a whole lot. Transactions are limited in number. Each transaction costs.
  - mrb 9y ago
    No. Transactions are NOT limited by the energy consumption of miners. Miners hash a fixed size 80-byte block header, regardless of how many transactions are in the block.

Each Bitcoin transaction uses 100 - 200kwh. It's absurd if you think about it. Isn't this going to be what dooms block chain let alone Bitcoin?

by pcurve 9y ago

Each Bitcoin transaction uses 100 - 200kwh. It's absurd if you think about it. Isn't this going to be what dooms block chain let alone Bitcoin?

nlperguiy 9y ago

Not if it's mining running on solar.

ajdlinux 9y ago
I hear this argument from my colleague who runs his mining rigs on a solar PV setup. Given how quickly we as a civilisation need to be moving away from fossil fuels, I don't buy that this is a better use than using your solar PV panels to feed back into the grid and thus reduce demand on non-renewable generators.
- nlperguiy 9y ago
  The amount of energy used for BTC is nothing compared to energy used for Internet. It's equivalent to 0, compared to usage for heating and cooling.

JauntyHatAngle 9y ago

Not all blockchains use PoW algos, or are decentralised in the bitcoin sense, or use the same hashing tools. Proof of stake is one example of how that doesn't "doom" blockchains.

seibelj 9y ago

It’s not just doing transactions. It’s maintaining $300billion in global wealth and rising every day, without any institutions or government. I’m sure the traditional financial system uses a lot of power as well...

ajdlinux 9y ago
The IBM mainframes that run most of the global financial system and maintain a few orders of magnitude more of global wealth are reasonably power hungry, yes, but I don't think the system averages consumption of kilowatt hours of energy every single time I swipe my credit card.
- seibelj 9y ago
  The act of transferring BTC doesn’t magically cause hundreds of megawatts of power to be wasted. Your transaction happening or not happening doesn’t alter the electrical useage of the system. The system uses electricity to protect itself from being taken over by a malicious actor.

mrb 9y ago

A bitcoin transaction does NOT use mining energy. Transaction rate and energy use are independent. The media always gets this wrong. It's like saying each bit on a CD-ROM "use fuel" when it's shipped on a mail truck.

rrobukef 9y ago
But there is a cost for each bit. It's amortized. Because at some point you need a second cd, which increases fuel a tiny bit, and lowers the amirtized cost per bit. At some point you need a bigger truck and then a second truck, suddenly the cost jumps up a whole lot. Transactions are limited in number. Each transaction costs.
- mrb 9y ago
  No. Transactions are NOT limited by the energy consumption of miners. Miners hash a fixed size 80-byte block header, regardless of how many transactions are in the block.