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personally, I would fast for the long term before I took on terms like that. Fasting is actually quite good for your health and many of us would benefit from i

personally, I would fast for the long term before I took on terms like that. Fasting is actually quite good for your health and many of us would benefit from it. in the US with frugal living, you live of 2-3$ per day, using the oatmeal plan. And, if your so poor you can't afford that, then it's irresponsible to have kids. At least not until you get back on your feet.

dazc 9y ago
I wonder what's the longest period of time you've ever fasted for? Many years ago I was homeless and broke for a period of time. At one point I didn't eat for 2 days, it wasn't easy and not something I'd be willing to do again voluntarily. 2 days sounds easy, right?
- Consultant32452 9y ago
  I've fasted for 3 days. Day 1 was kinda rough, day 2 was easier imo. Day 3 was the easiest of the 3 days. That said, I fasted from a place of luxury. Not eating because you literally have no food available is a completely different psychological experience.
- maxxxxx 9y ago
  Fasting for even a week is no problem when you have been well fed before. It's not so much fun and not so healthy when you are already underfed or malnourished when you start. Recommending fasting to poor people is pretty arrogant.
s73ver_ 9y ago
"And, if your so poor you can't afford that, then it's irresponsible to have kids." Hindsight is 20/20. What do you do if you already have kids?
eropple 9y ago
That's nice that you say you would do that. It is also divorced from reality; what you're describing as "fasting" is what normal people call fucking starving, dude. People don't get to decide that suddenly they were laid off and the economy sucks so it's been a long time since they had steady work beyond the very-part-time job at the convenience store and they don't get to decide that their seven-year-old, born when things were great and when Dad was still around and your family had a second income, needs to not go hungry. You are representing a callous, gross viewpoint and I genuinely hope it never comes back to make you regret it.
- pascalxus 9y ago
  the point is, with the appropriate education, early enough, we can avoid these situations. by taking on these loans, it's only going to make their situation even worse.
  - wpietri 9y ago
    You are right on neither point. Education is neither necessary nor sufficient to keep people from desperate situations. And taking a payday loan often makes the situation better. Always in the short term, sometimes in the long. Expecting somebody to let their family starve or become homeless rather than taking a payday loan is ridiculous.
  - eropple 9y ago
    "We should close the barn door after the horse is a county away" is not a useful, meaningful, or insightful point. So why make it? And, worse, it's wrong besides. Plenty of well-educated people screw up. Plenty of well-educated people are suckered by scams of all types, even people who literally do know better. Life is complicated, it comes at you fast, and one mistake, when you are not so fortunate as to have the kind of (tech) jobs that let you make mistakes, can be profoundly destructive. See my post elsewhere in this thread for more: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15863152 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15863152
  - CocaKoala 9y ago
    Sure, but the situation is already dire. What's the difference if it gets worse in three weeks? It might get worse in three weeks anyways, and at least if you take the predatory loan you'll have some money to keep the electricity on for another few days. The loan won't improve your situation, but not taking the loan sure as hell isn't going to improve it either.
  - vertex-four 9y ago
    The solution is not to educate people to starve or go homeless instead of taking loans. It's to ensure that nobody is placed in a position where they're stuck between starving/going homeless/etc and taking out a payday loan. If the current system is not ensuring that, what changes would ensure it? That's the question.
ksenzee 9y ago
We have a word for "fasting for the long term": starving. You are saying you would starve before taking out a loan on unfavorable terms. How long would you starve? One month? Two? At what point would you decide you'd rather deal with debt collectors than die of starvation? > Fasting is actually quite good for your health and many of us would benefit from it. We've reached peak HN, folks. Pack it in.
pavel_lishin 9y ago
> And, if your so poor you can't afford that, then it's irresponsible to have kids. So what happens if you had kids while you were prosperous, but then become poor? You might be willing to fast for a week (have you tried?), but it's an entirely different thing to make a six year old fast.

dazc 9y ago

I wonder what's the longest period of time you've ever fasted for? Many years ago I was homeless and broke for a period of time. At one point I didn't eat for 2 days, it wasn't easy and not something I'd be willing to do again voluntarily. 2 days sounds easy, right?

Consultant32452 9y ago
I've fasted for 3 days. Day 1 was kinda rough, day 2 was easier imo. Day 3 was the easiest of the 3 days. That said, I fasted from a place of luxury. Not eating because you literally have no food available is a completely different psychological experience.
maxxxxx 9y ago
Fasting for even a week is no problem when you have been well fed before. It's not so much fun and not so healthy when you are already underfed or malnourished when you start. Recommending fasting to poor people is pretty arrogant.

s73ver_ 9y ago

"And, if your so poor you can't afford that, then it's irresponsible to have kids." Hindsight is 20/20. What do you do if you already have kids?

eropple 9y ago

That's nice that you say you would do that. It is also divorced from reality; what you're describing as "fasting" is what normal people call fucking starving, dude. People don't get to decide that suddenly they were laid off and the economy sucks so it's been a long time since they had steady work beyond the very-part-time job at the convenience store and they don't get to decide that their seven-year-old, born when things were great and when Dad was still around and your family had a second income, needs to not go hungry. You are representing a callous, gross viewpoint and I genuinely hope it never comes back to make you regret it.

pascalxus 9y ago
the point is, with the appropriate education, early enough, we can avoid these situations. by taking on these loans, it's only going to make their situation even worse.
- wpietri 9y ago
  You are right on neither point. Education is neither necessary nor sufficient to keep people from desperate situations. And taking a payday loan often makes the situation better. Always in the short term, sometimes in the long. Expecting somebody to let their family starve or become homeless rather than taking a payday loan is ridiculous.
- eropple 9y ago
  "We should close the barn door after the horse is a county away" is not a useful, meaningful, or insightful point. So why make it? And, worse, it's wrong besides. Plenty of well-educated people screw up. Plenty of well-educated people are suckered by scams of all types, even people who literally do know better. Life is complicated, it comes at you fast, and one mistake, when you are not so fortunate as to have the kind of (tech) jobs that let you make mistakes, can be profoundly destructive. See my post elsewhere in this thread for more: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15863152 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15863152
- CocaKoala 9y ago
  Sure, but the situation is already dire. What's the difference if it gets worse in three weeks? It might get worse in three weeks anyways, and at least if you take the predatory loan you'll have some money to keep the electricity on for another few days. The loan won't improve your situation, but not taking the loan sure as hell isn't going to improve it either.
- vertex-four 9y ago
  The solution is not to educate people to starve or go homeless instead of taking loans. It's to ensure that nobody is placed in a position where they're stuck between starving/going homeless/etc and taking out a payday loan. If the current system is not ensuring that, what changes would ensure it? That's the question.

ksenzee 9y ago

We have a word for "fasting for the long term": starving. You are saying you would starve before taking out a loan on unfavorable terms. How long would you starve? One month? Two? At what point would you decide you'd rather deal with debt collectors than die of starvation? > Fasting is actually quite good for your health and many of us would benefit from it. We've reached peak HN, folks. Pack it in.

pavel_lishin 9y ago

> And, if your so poor you can't afford that, then it's irresponsible to have kids. So what happens if you had kids while you were prosperous, but then become poor? You might be willing to fast for a week (have you tried?), but it's an entirely different thing to make a six year old fast.