4 ms·

Yes, many of us do. The vast majority of US gun-owners are not criminals, and the social problems that gun ownership seems to correlate with can be argued, deba

by Helmet 9y ago

Yes, many of us do. The vast majority of US gun-owners are not criminals, and the social problems that gun ownership seems to correlate with can be argued, debated, and squared away with "other" strong correlations, so the debate is certainly not settled. Both the American Revolutionary and Civil War have only hardened my position on the importance of gun ownership. There is a fundamental ideological divide between us that drives these positions. You can call me a cook, crank, nutter, clinger, whatever you want, but the fact is this: I simply don't trust the government and I believe in the right to arm and protect myself at any and all costs.

dalbasal 9y ago
The civil war?
- Helmet 9y ago
  The Civil War was, essentially, fought to preserve the institution of slavery. The period after the Civil War was marked by incredible violence against blacks by the KKK and racist whites and white mobs. Blacks protected themselves, their families and their communities through armed resistance. They could finally "shoot back". In fact, some of the earliest gun control measures were taken up TO KEEP GUNS AWAY FROM BLACKS, so that they could not resist against the atrocities of slavery. It isn't talked about because white liberal academic elites are so hostile to guns, but armed resistance and guns were a central part of the civil rights movement. Recommended reading for you: We Will Shoot Back - Umoja Negros With Guns - Williams, Martin Luther King Jr., Truman Nelson Negroes and the Gun: The Black Tradition of Arms - Johnson
scotty79 9y ago
> I simply don't trust the government and I believe in the right to arm and protect myself at any and all costs. But you are aware that your government has tanks, drones and vast selection of chemical weapons. Soon they'll have lethal drones small enough to make a person with gun just as harmless as a person without a gun. People that want guns, I feel, think they are living with their minds in the future where they heroically oppose facist leaning government with their trusty guns. I feel they are in fact living in the glorious past when such thing was possible, not even in the present when goverment has all the power industry manufactured for military since the beginning of industrial revolution. Definitely not in the future when you'll be just labeled domestic terrorist and bombed, gassed, sniped from at least a mile or assasinated by a drone. Guns today in context of opposing government are just imagination enhacers same way as D&D figurines, just less harmless.
- Helmet 9y ago
  All that technology, and yet a bunch of Vietnamese living in small villages and mud huts put up enough of a fight to create a permanent sore spot in US military history. Also, those guys we've been trying to kill for the past 15 years in the middle east keep coming back fiercer than ever. And who do you think operates all that fancy technology? Men who own guns and whose fathers owned guns before them. No, not all of them, but by and large. So I wouldn't be so sure that they would be on "your" side if push came to shove.
  - scotty79 9y ago
    > All that technology, and yet a bunch of Vietnamese living in small villages and mud huts put up enough of a fight to create a permanent sore spot in US military history. The table titled Belligerents on the page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_War doesn't say "US gov" vs "mudhut villagers". Do you expect Soviets to help you with your struggle with your oppressive US government? Besides it was 40 years ago which is pretty much ancient time for military and anti-riot technology. > Also, those guys we've been trying to kill for the past 15 years in the middle east keep coming back fiercer than ever. So losses of 15000 isis soldiers for each US military soldier dead is for you "guys ... in the middle east coming back fiercer than ever"? You'd like to be of the loosing side of such conflict for whatever reason? > And who do you think operates all that fancy technology? Men who own guns and whose fathers owned guns before them. Not necessarily own, just operate. I don't think that soldiers have significantly higher gun ownership percentage than civilians. Also all of them have a strong opinion about obeying your superiors, kinda goes along with the job. I don't think they'll be sympathetic to bunch of civilians that don't obey their superiors.

by Helmet 9y ago

dalbasal 9y ago

The civil war?

Helmet 9y ago
The Civil War was, essentially, fought to preserve the institution of slavery. The period after the Civil War was marked by incredible violence against blacks by the KKK and racist whites and white mobs. Blacks protected themselves, their families and their communities through armed resistance. They could finally "shoot back". In fact, some of the earliest gun control measures were taken up TO KEEP GUNS AWAY FROM BLACKS, so that they could not resist against the atrocities of slavery. It isn't talked about because white liberal academic elites are so hostile to guns, but armed resistance and guns were a central part of the civil rights movement. Recommended reading for you: We Will Shoot Back - Umoja Negros With Guns - Williams, Martin Luther King Jr., Truman Nelson Negroes and the Gun: The Black Tradition of Arms - Johnson

scotty79 9y ago

> I simply don't trust the government and I believe in the right to arm and protect myself at any and all costs. But you are aware that your government has tanks, drones and vast selection of chemical weapons. Soon they'll have lethal drones small enough to make a person with gun just as harmless as a person without a gun. People that want guns, I feel, think they are living with their minds in the future where they heroically oppose facist leaning government with their trusty guns. I feel they are in fact living in the glorious past when such thing was possible, not even in the present when goverment has all the power industry manufactured for military since the beginning of industrial revolution. Definitely not in the future when you'll be just labeled domestic terrorist and bombed, gassed, sniped from at least a mile or assasinated by a drone. Guns today in context of opposing government are just imagination enhacers same way as D&D figurines, just less harmless.

Helmet 9y ago
All that technology, and yet a bunch of Vietnamese living in small villages and mud huts put up enough of a fight to create a permanent sore spot in US military history. Also, those guys we've been trying to kill for the past 15 years in the middle east keep coming back fiercer than ever. And who do you think operates all that fancy technology? Men who own guns and whose fathers owned guns before them. No, not all of them, but by and large. So I wouldn't be so sure that they would be on "your" side if push came to shove.
- scotty79 9y ago
  > All that technology, and yet a bunch of Vietnamese living in small villages and mud huts put up enough of a fight to create a permanent sore spot in US military history. The table titled Belligerents on the page https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_War https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vietnam_War doesn't say "US gov" vs "mudhut villagers". Do you expect Soviets to help you with your struggle with your oppressive US government? Besides it was 40 years ago which is pretty much ancient time for military and anti-riot technology. > Also, those guys we've been trying to kill for the past 15 years in the middle east keep coming back fiercer than ever. So losses of 15000 isis soldiers for each US military soldier dead is for you "guys ... in the middle east coming back fiercer than ever"? You'd like to be of the loosing side of such conflict for whatever reason? > And who do you think operates all that fancy technology? Men who own guns and whose fathers owned guns before them. Not necessarily own, just operate. I don't think that soldiers have significantly higher gun ownership percentage than civilians. Also all of them have a strong opinion about obeying your superiors, kinda goes along with the job. I don't think they'll be sympathetic to bunch of civilians that don't obey their superiors.