4 ms·

anecdotal evidence from my pesticide free farm, this year I've had massive amount of bugs. Hundreds if not thousands of butterflies, massive house/horse fly pro

by delbel 9y ago

anecdotal evidence from my pesticide free farm, this year I've had massive amount of bugs. Hundreds if not thousands of butterflies, massive house/horse fly problems, ant invasions, moths clogging up my plant propagator pumps, frog population explosion (there are now frogs in my office when people come visit me, they get "woken up" and I have to explain to them), massive bird population. Its 33f right now, and I see them flying around on my security camera system - so much I've had to disable the motion detection system the entire year because it is completely worthless even with the latest detection algorithm, with several cameras having massive spider webs because the bugs are attracted to the IR light. It could be a massive die off of bugs, but not here (Oregon).

canada_dry 9y ago
> my pesticide free farm Well of course. I suspect insects of every type are now doing the equivalent of war-driving to find Monsanto free areas they can live.
- VMG 9y ago
  Is this advertisement for Monsanto? Humans have been trying to get rid of pests for centuries, Monsanto didn't start it.
  - llukas 9y ago
    You're right, Monsanto didn't start it. They ended it.
  - cJ0th 9y ago
    That's like saying: Humans have fought each other with weapons since the beginning of time. Nukes are just another weapon...
- u320 9y ago
  Monsanto is a herbicide vendor, not a pesticide vendor. Not everything you dislike about the ag sector is Monsantos doing.
  - schiffern 9y ago
    > Monsanto is a herbicide vendor, not a pesticide vendor. 1) Entirely pedantic, but Monsanto certainly is a pesticide vendor. They aren't an insecticide vendor (which is what you meant), but herbicides, insecticides, and fungicides all fall under the umbrella of "pesticides." 2) canada_dry talked about finding "Monsanto free areas," and that's still accurate. The monoculture cropping that makes herbicides necessary eliminates all the "non-productive" plants that act as habitat for pest-controlling predator species, making pesticides necessary. Monsanto may not make insecticides, but their business model depends on an agriculture system that inevitably leads to using insecticides. Wait, is it really true that monoculture inevitably leads to pests? Yes, because ecological niches have been left unfilled, so nature steps in to fill them. Monoculture farms being overrun by pests is as unsurprising to an ecologist as an inverted broomstick falling over is to a physicist. You created an unstable system, and it's trying to return to equilibrium. At that point you have two options. You can spend the rest of your life balancing the broomstick, or you can lean it against a wall. We can spend the remaining lifespan of our [relatively young] global civilization tilling and pouring biocides on 40% of Earth's land surface (and an assuredly short lifespan it will be, as the soils erode away,[1] deforestation shuts down the terrestrial water cycle,[2] the continents desertify,[3][4] and the aquifers deplete[5]), or we can adopt stable polyculture food growing systems that intentionally fill those open ecological niches with productive species. Ecosystem engineering (working with nature) vs open-loop, leaking, unsustainable systems that only benefits chemical manufacturers and distributors. [1] https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/only-60-years-of-farming-left-if-soil-degradation-continues/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/only-60-years-of-... [2] http://www.nature.com/articles/nature11983 http://www.nature.com/articles/nature11983 [3] http://www.forestclimate.org/desert.html http://www.forestclimate.org/desert.html [4] http://www.sustainabilitylabs.org/ecosystem-restoration/learning-modules/has-human-activity-caused-the-spread-of-deserts-in-the-middle-east-and-worldwide-and-can-human-intervention-reverse-it/ http://www.sustainabilitylabs.org/ecosystem-restoration/lear... [5] https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/08/140819-groundwater-california-drought-aquifers-hidden-crisis/ https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/08/140819-grou...
    - b0rsuk 9y ago
unhammer 9y ago
> (there are now frogs in my office when people come visit me, they get "woken up" and I have to explain to them) How do you explain to your frogs that you woke them up?
- dragandj 9y ago
  I imagine they wanted to say that they apologize to their frogs for waking them up :)
b0rsuk 9y ago
Well the garden I mentioned is close to a busy street. It could be the increase in traffic. I'm happy to hear about your insect diversity. I hope if you ever get fed up with them you'll use natural countermeasures, such as installing bird nesting booths (a great tit catches over 300 bugs per day...and it sounds nice). I mean in Africa they're starting to use bee hives to deter elephants from farms, surely you can't be worse. May the frogs and spiders be on your side.

by delbel 9y ago

canada_dry 9y ago

> my pesticide free farm Well of course. I suspect insects of every type are now doing the equivalent of war-driving to find Monsanto free areas they can live.

VMG 9y ago
Is this advertisement for Monsanto? Humans have been trying to get rid of pests for centuries, Monsanto didn't start it.
- llukas 9y ago
  You're right, Monsanto didn't start it. They ended it.
- cJ0th 9y ago
  That's like saying: Humans have fought each other with weapons since the beginning of time. Nukes are just another weapon...
u320 9y ago
Monsanto is a herbicide vendor, not a pesticide vendor. Not everything you dislike about the ag sector is Monsantos doing.
- schiffern 9y ago
  > Monsanto is a herbicide vendor, not a pesticide vendor. 1) Entirely pedantic, but Monsanto certainly is a pesticide vendor. They aren't an insecticide vendor (which is what you meant), but herbicides, insecticides, and fungicides all fall under the umbrella of "pesticides." 2) canada_dry talked about finding "Monsanto free areas," and that's still accurate. The monoculture cropping that makes herbicides necessary eliminates all the "non-productive" plants that act as habitat for pest-controlling predator species, making pesticides necessary. Monsanto may not make insecticides, but their business model depends on an agriculture system that inevitably leads to using insecticides. Wait, is it really true that monoculture inevitably leads to pests? Yes, because ecological niches have been left unfilled, so nature steps in to fill them. Monoculture farms being overrun by pests is as unsurprising to an ecologist as an inverted broomstick falling over is to a physicist. You created an unstable system, and it's trying to return to equilibrium. At that point you have two options. You can spend the rest of your life balancing the broomstick, or you can lean it against a wall. We can spend the remaining lifespan of our [relatively young] global civilization tilling and pouring biocides on 40% of Earth's land surface (and an assuredly short lifespan it will be, as the soils erode away,[1] deforestation shuts down the terrestrial water cycle,[2] the continents desertify,[3][4] and the aquifers deplete[5]), or we can adopt stable polyculture food growing systems that intentionally fill those open ecological niches with productive species. Ecosystem engineering (working with nature) vs open-loop, leaking, unsustainable systems that only benefits chemical manufacturers and distributors. [1] https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/only-60-years-of-farming-left-if-soil-degradation-continues/ https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/only-60-years-of-... [2] http://www.nature.com/articles/nature11983 http://www.nature.com/articles/nature11983 [3] http://www.forestclimate.org/desert.html http://www.forestclimate.org/desert.html [4] http://www.sustainabilitylabs.org/ecosystem-restoration/learning-modules/has-human-activity-caused-the-spread-of-deserts-in-the-middle-east-and-worldwide-and-can-human-intervention-reverse-it/ http://www.sustainabilitylabs.org/ecosystem-restoration/lear... [5] https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/08/140819-groundwater-california-drought-aquifers-hidden-crisis/ https://news.nationalgeographic.com/news/2014/08/140819-grou...
  - b0rsuk 9y ago

unhammer 9y ago

> (there are now frogs in my office when people come visit me, they get "woken up" and I have to explain to them) How do you explain to your frogs that you woke them up?

dragandj 9y ago
I imagine they wanted to say that they apologize to their frogs for waking them up :)

b0rsuk 9y ago

Well the garden I mentioned is close to a busy street. It could be the increase in traffic. I'm happy to hear about your insect diversity. I hope if you ever get fed up with them you'll use natural countermeasures, such as installing bird nesting booths (a great tit catches over 300 bugs per day...and it sounds nice). I mean in Africa they're starting to use bee hives to deter elephants from farms, surely you can't be worse. May the frogs and spiders be on your side.