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> least corrupt nations on the planet Only because you don't define lobbying as corruption. In most (any?) other nation, individuals and corporations paying le

> least corrupt nations on the planet Only because you don't define lobbying as corruption. In most (any?) other nation, individuals and corporations paying legislators to vote a certain way fits the definition of bribery and corruption perfectly.

twoodfin 9y ago
That is bribery in the US, too, and it is illegal.
- FireBeyond 9y ago
  Yeah, except in the US, the fine line can be as narrow as the difference between: "Take this money for your campaign and pass this law" - bribery; and "Take this money for your campaign. I'd really like to see this law pass." - lobbying.
  - twoodfin 9y ago
    First, there’s a significant distinction between campaign donations and “paying legislators” cash. Second, so-called “hard money” corporate donations to federal electoral campaigns have been and remain illegal. Failing to make these distinctions and commenting as if corporate lobbyists are literally handing over suitcases full of cash is deceptive.
lawn 9y ago
This combined with civil forfeiture gives me a really hard time classifying it as anything else than corrupt.
- CodeMage 9y ago
  Let's not forget about bill riders: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rider_(legislation) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rider_(legislation)
rayiner 9y ago
It’s a good thing that’s not what lobbying is! Think more power points and less cash.
coliveira 9y ago
Exactly. Historically, corruption has been carefully defined to exclude everything the running elite of a country is doing. Many of the behaviors observed in the US could easily be classified as corruption, but, surprise, there are very handy laws that allow them to continue unchallenged.
ekianjo 9y ago
And political campaigns financed by corporations fits nicely in corruption/conflict of interest as well.
- chimeracoder 9y ago
  > And political campaigns financed by corporations fits nicely in corruption/conflict of interest as well. Good thing, then, that it's already illegal in the US for corporations to finance a political campaign!
  - ekianjo 9y ago
    you are right! I had to look it up, and it became a law back in 1907 in the US. I wonder how much impact corporations involvements had before that time.
chimeracoder 9y ago
> Only because you don't define lobbying as corruption. In most (any?) other nation, individuals and corporations paying legislators to vote a certain way fits the definition of bribery and corruption perfectly. What you're describing isn't lobbying, and is already illegal under US law.

twoodfin 9y ago

That is bribery in the US, too, and it is illegal.

FireBeyond 9y ago
Yeah, except in the US, the fine line can be as narrow as the difference between: "Take this money for your campaign and pass this law" - bribery; and "Take this money for your campaign. I'd really like to see this law pass." - lobbying.
- twoodfin 9y ago
  First, there’s a significant distinction between campaign donations and “paying legislators” cash. Second, so-called “hard money” corporate donations to federal electoral campaigns have been and remain illegal. Failing to make these distinctions and commenting as if corporate lobbyists are literally handing over suitcases full of cash is deceptive.

lawn 9y ago

This combined with civil forfeiture gives me a really hard time classifying it as anything else than corrupt.

CodeMage 9y ago
Let's not forget about bill riders: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rider_(legislation) https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rider_(legislation)

rayiner 9y ago

It’s a good thing that’s not what lobbying is! Think more power points and less cash.

coliveira 9y ago

Exactly. Historically, corruption has been carefully defined to exclude everything the running elite of a country is doing. Many of the behaviors observed in the US could easily be classified as corruption, but, surprise, there are very handy laws that allow them to continue unchallenged.

ekianjo 9y ago

And political campaigns financed by corporations fits nicely in corruption/conflict of interest as well.

chimeracoder 9y ago
> And political campaigns financed by corporations fits nicely in corruption/conflict of interest as well. Good thing, then, that it's already illegal in the US for corporations to finance a political campaign!
- ekianjo 9y ago
  you are right! I had to look it up, and it became a law back in 1907 in the US. I wonder how much impact corporations involvements had before that time.

chimeracoder 9y ago

> Only because you don't define lobbying as corruption. In most (any?) other nation, individuals and corporations paying legislators to vote a certain way fits the definition of bribery and corruption perfectly. What you're describing isn't lobbying, and is already illegal under US law.