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> Salary history may be discussed if an applicant “voluntarily and without prompting” discloses salary history to a potential employer. People who believe they
by bulatb 9y ago
> Salary history may be discussed if an applicant “voluntarily and without prompting” discloses salary history to a potential employer.
People who believe they're highly paid might find it advantageous to disclose that: they'd avoid an accidental lowball, companies that can't afford them, etc. So there should be three types of people: (1) those who disclose and are highly paid, (2) those who disclose and think they're highly paid but aren't, and (3) those who don't disclose.
If being in group 1 is advantageous, then not disclosing (group 3) could be taken as a signal that the person thinks their salary is low and doesn't want to be anchored--but isn't that the information this law is supposed to be hiding? Even though they haven't named a price, it's still a signal that they might accept an offer under market.
On the other hand, that makes it harder for employers to calculate an offer that's more than they're making but still under market. And the gap should shrink with every job change, in theory.
Is there any data (maybe from other states) on how the game theory shakes out here?
Edit: another provision makes it more complicated.
> (c) An employer, upon reasonable request, shall provide the pay scale for a position to an applicant applying for employment.
- stale2002 9y agoWell, you missed group 4. Group 4 is "people who aren't doing game theory in their head, and don't even think to give their salary, if they weren't asked it". And group 4 likely makes up the vast majority of people.
- tonyhb 9y agoEveryone fails to disclose, then waits for an offer, then negotiates. Given the first offer people in group #1 (paid highly) still have an advantage when negotiating ("I'm paid more now"). People in #2 will learn that they're not paid as much as they think they are if the offer is good. People in #3 remain the same and should have +EV. All groups can still negotiate.
- cm2187 9y agoPlus there is no perfect information. People in category #1 may not necessarily believe they are highly paid. The grass is always greener...
- bulatb 9y agoIt feels like there's some value in disclosing that's greater than the risk of leaving money on the table if the other groups behave as expected, but I can't put my finger on it. Maybe just one of those economic fallacies.
- otakucode 9y agoWhoever says a number first loses. That's some piece of wisdom that I don't recall the source of, but I believe it addresses what you're feeling.
- bulatb 9y agoI think it's the opposite: it feels like this law might create an incentive for certain people to go first and thereby change the meaning of not going first for everyone else. But I can't support it, so I'm probably wrong.
- user5994461 9y agoAn incorrect meme.
- maxxxxx 9y agoI hear that all the time but I have had decent success by giving a high number first. I have never had a company offer more than I expected.
- coffeemug 9y ago(4) those who disclose and lie, because there is nobody in the recruiting chain who'll ever bother to check
- bulatb 9y agoHN counts to 3: 1, 2, 3, 4, 4/1, 8/2... :) I figured it was common enough for employers to check since they can buy the data, but I have no idea.
- TimPC 9y agoThey can kind-of sort-of somewhat buy some of the data but the data sources they can buy from have errors, don't account for stock compensation, often misaccount for money going into 401K's or stock purchase plans, healthcare and other payroll deductions. They sometimes mishandle bonuses as well. If the data you buy has these errors you might reject a candidate whose not lying because their total comp was half stock and they maximized their 401K and stock purchase plans making the bank underestimate their salary.
- misternotsure 9y agoWhat data can they buy, and how do they buy it?
- 0x4f3759df 9y agoEquifax has a salary lookup service. https://krebsonsecurity.com/2017/11/equifax-reopens-salary-lookup-service/ https://krebsonsecurity.com/2017/11/equifax-reopens-salary-l...
- jstarfish 9y agoThey only have data for those employers who opt into it though. It's mostly entry-level-type positions (supermarkets, convenience stores, temp agencies, etc) but there are some larger clients in that pool too.
- curun1r 9y agoHow much you made previously is somewhat irrelevant. How much you'd like to make is much more relevant. That conversation can still happen. The only difference is that applicants don't have to be anchored by their previous salary. They can ask for whatever they want. I'm not sure I see why the same dynamics that you describe wouldn't still play out using the applicant's desired salary instead of their current/previous salary.
- s73ver_ 9y agoI guess I don't see how C makes things any more complicated. The employer has a budget in mind when creating the position.
- nunez 9y agoDisclosing your salary no matter how high or low is disadvantageous to increasing it; it sets an anchor