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Fire code where? Requirement to be networked is a new thing to me, at least as far as single family dwellings go.

by 0culus 9y ago

junkcollector 9y ago
I've dealt with it in the state fire code for Massachusetts and Maryland. I believe it is also in the New York and New Jersey code books. I'm unsure of other states but, it is a relatively recent adoption in all of the aforementioned states and I expect that it will be common in nearly all states soon. If it seems to be a bit much just be glad you aren't in Massachusetts where they are currently trying to get arc flash rated 110V breakers added as a requirement to the electric code.
- mindslight 9y ago
  > trying to get arc flash rated 110V breakers added as a requirement to the electric code. Are you just talking about MA adopting newer versions of the NEC that require AFCI [0] more places, or is there really something new related to arc flash? [0] A proprietary software hellhole, like everything else these days.
- brudgers 9y ago
  Arc fault protection for outlets in dwelling bedrooms was was new in the 2002 NEC. Back then, the only available solution was an arc-fault interrupt circuit breaker. Arc fault receptacles are currently available in the market place... ...however, the code (at least back in 2002) specified protection of all electrical outlets. Receptacles are plugged into outlets. So are hired wired lights, smoke detectors, etc. An outlet is "A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment." This means that any literal reading of the code requires arc-fault breakers from a practical perspective since even the outlet into which an arc-fault receptacle is plugged requires protection upstream from the receptacle. On the other hand, building departments often make code interpretations that are politically expedient and that's why some jurisdictions may allow arc-fault receptacles as a means of code compliance.
  - mindslight 9y ago
    Erm, receptacles are a type of outlet. AFAIK the code also requires the wiring itself in those places be AFCI protected, since the (immediate) goal was to avoid smoldering fires in the wall where people sleep. This would imply the simplest route is an AFCI breaker for the whole branch circuit, although it was (is?) permissible to run metal conduit up to the first receptacle and have that do the AFCI. Would have loved for the NEC to require that the code on AFCIs was technician-upgradeable and some general sense of open, but I'll just go back to banging my head against the wall now.
Washuu 9y ago
Networked isn't really the right term. Hardwired fire alarms are the new requirement. They just have AC power with battery backup and an additional wire that triggers all the wired alarms to go off when one goes off.
- jrochkind1 9y ago
  In Maryland at least, there are non-hard-wired alternatives in some cases that aren't new construction but still trigger an upgrade required. I have some that have "long-term tamper-proof batteries" (I think they last 5 years or something)... and _somehow_ are "interconnected" (so they can all trigger each other) which was a requirement. They don't use _my_ wifi, I don't know how they are interconnected without wires exactly (or if it even really works). I'm not worried about it, but it passed inspection.

Fire code where? Requirement to be networked is a new thing to me, at least as far as single family dwellings go.

by 0culus 9y ago

Fire code where? Requirement to be networked is a new thing to me, at least as far as single family dwellings go.

I've dealt with it in the state fire code for Massachusetts and Maryland. I believe it is also in the New York and New Jersey code books. I'm unsure of other states but, it is a relatively recent adoption in all of the aforementioned states and I expect that it will be common in nearly all states soon. If it seems to be a bit much just be glad you aren't in Massachusetts where they are currently trying to get arc flash rated 110V breakers added as a requirement to the electric code.

mindslight 9y ago
> trying to get arc flash rated 110V breakers added as a requirement to the electric code. Are you just talking about MA adopting newer versions of the NEC that require AFCI [0] more places, or is there really something new related to arc flash? [0] A proprietary software hellhole, like everything else these days.
brudgers 9y ago
Arc fault protection for outlets in dwelling bedrooms was was new in the 2002 NEC. Back then, the only available solution was an arc-fault interrupt circuit breaker. Arc fault receptacles are currently available in the market place... ...however, the code (at least back in 2002) specified protection of all electrical outlets. Receptacles are plugged into outlets. So are hired wired lights, smoke detectors, etc. An outlet is "A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment." This means that any literal reading of the code requires arc-fault breakers from a practical perspective since even the outlet into which an arc-fault receptacle is plugged requires protection upstream from the receptacle. On the other hand, building departments often make code interpretations that are politically expedient and that's why some jurisdictions may allow arc-fault receptacles as a means of code compliance.
- mindslight 9y ago
  Erm, receptacles are a type of outlet. AFAIK the code also requires the wiring itself in those places be AFCI protected, since the (immediate) goal was to avoid smoldering fires in the wall where people sleep. This would imply the simplest route is an AFCI breaker for the whole branch circuit, although it was (is?) permissible to run metal conduit up to the first receptacle and have that do the AFCI. Would have loved for the NEC to require that the code on AFCIs was technician-upgradeable and some general sense of open, but I'll just go back to banging my head against the wall now.

Washuu 9y ago

Networked isn't really the right term. Hardwired fire alarms are the new requirement. They just have AC power with battery backup and an additional wire that triggers all the wired alarms to go off when one goes off.

jrochkind1 9y ago
In Maryland at least, there are non-hard-wired alternatives in some cases that aren't new construction but still trigger an upgrade required. I have some that have "long-term tamper-proof batteries" (I think they last 5 years or something)... and _somehow_ are "interconnected" (so they can all trigger each other) which was a requirement. They don't use _my_ wifi, I don't know how they are interconnected without wires exactly (or if it even really works). I'm not worried about it, but it passed inspection.