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> I don't know of an anywhere-near-ideally functioning democracy in the world Democracies need to be running at a small scale. Check out the swiss: https://ww

by cies 9y ago

> I don't know of an anywhere-near-ideally functioning democracy in the world Democracies need to be running at a small scale. Check out the swiss: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSLs5G4SPP4&t=64s https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dSLs5G4SPP4&t=64s Of read up on "democratic confederalism" (now used in the north of Syria): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqfoJvD0Ifg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gqfoJvD0Ifg > I mean just think about it. who's in the best position to influence the will of a large amount of people? With lobbying you do not even have to go by the people, you simply pay-to-play in politics. That's just legalized corruption, thus anti-democratic. > Recently I've started to think that democracy is never the steady state of any government, it's just a stepping stone to democratic republics and then to oligarchy. That's an obvious progression if the democracy is highly centralized and lobbyable (or otherwise corrupt). > technological advances are the only things that seem to truly shake things up Currently tech it largely "bought", and thus used in the advantage of the capital-heavy. Nature and labor are totally subservient to capital in the current system. A well functioning democracy can turn that around, but they seems to be increasingly less functioning.

hardwaresofton 9y ago
so basically democracy doesn't scale? I agree with what you pointed out, but maybe I should have noted that I meant for any large-ish nation. Maybe it would be better if I rephrased: I don't think it's possible for a large nation to have a well-functioning democracy for a long period of time. Unless the democracy is damn near (or actually) perfect, someone will eventually get the upper hand, start a pay-to-play system or find a way to slide the scales and you'll get on that same old progression. [EDIT] - wanted to note that I really appreciate the links, watching them now, thanks!
- cies 9y ago
  > so basically democracy doesn't scale? Doesn't scale "up", but scales "out" well :) > Maybe it would be better if I rephrased: I don't think it's possible for a large nation to have a well-functioning democracy for a long period of time. Unless the democracy is damn near (or actually) perfect, someone will eventually get the upper hand, start a pay-to-play system or find a way to slide the scales and you'll get on that same old progression. Yes. I agree. Democracy should be on low(est) geographical regions. And "perfect" is the enemy of "good enough". Some large nations have (had) quite "ok" democracies (the swiss, some of the scandies, and now maybe some baltics as well -- arguably they are not very big nations though). > [EDIT] - wanted to note that I really appreciate the links, watching them now, thanks! Welcome. Spread the ideas, this stuff is important. You might be interested in "market socialism" as well :)

by cies 9y ago

hardwaresofton 9y ago

so basically democracy doesn't scale? I agree with what you pointed out, but maybe I should have noted that I meant for any large-ish nation. Maybe it would be better if I rephrased: I don't think it's possible for a large nation to have a well-functioning democracy for a long period of time. Unless the democracy is damn near (or actually) perfect, someone will eventually get the upper hand, start a pay-to-play system or find a way to slide the scales and you'll get on that same old progression. [EDIT] - wanted to note that I really appreciate the links, watching them now, thanks!

cies 9y ago
> so basically democracy doesn't scale? Doesn't scale "up", but scales "out" well :) > Maybe it would be better if I rephrased: I don't think it's possible for a large nation to have a well-functioning democracy for a long period of time. Unless the democracy is damn near (or actually) perfect, someone will eventually get the upper hand, start a pay-to-play system or find a way to slide the scales and you'll get on that same old progression. Yes. I agree. Democracy should be on low(est) geographical regions. And "perfect" is the enemy of "good enough". Some large nations have (had) quite "ok" democracies (the swiss, some of the scandies, and now maybe some baltics as well -- arguably they are not very big nations though). > [EDIT] - wanted to note that I really appreciate the links, watching them now, thanks! Welcome. Spread the ideas, this stuff is important. You might be interested in "market socialism" as well :)