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Or you could say it is in price discovery. How much value do people want to tx in a censorship resistant, non-percentage charging transfer system? How many tx

Or you could say it is in price discovery. How much value do people want to tx in a censorship resistant, non-percentage charging transfer system? How many tx currently cost more than they would if bitcoin was widely accepted? How many people want to buy gold but don't want to have third party trust with an organization that holds gold or have to hold it themselves. If bitcoin exists it's price discovery period then the use cases above give it value.

tomcart 9y ago
> How many people want to buy gold but don't want to have third party trust with an organization that holds gold or have to hold it themselves. How is this different with Bitcoin? Edit: by which i mean, either you work out what do do with the key, or you trust an exchange/online wallet provider to do it for you.
- russdpale 9y ago
  Well because gold is heavy and large and tough to hide.
  - XR0CSWV3h3kZWg 9y ago
    Also divide and prove purity. Both are trivial for bitcoin.
rhino369 9y ago
Why would someone be afraid of a Gold ETF that you can buy with a free e-trade account but invest money in online monopoly money?
- russdpale 9y ago
  Because the government can very easily seize your etf? They could even physically confiscate the gold rendering your note useless. This equivalent is logistically impossible with bitcoin and the more nodes the stronger it becomes to resisting censorship. They would literally have to buy every single bitcoin (probably at tremendous price increase) and throw away the private key. Even leaving just 1 satoshi would render this plan completely useless. And because around %15 or so of the bitcoins have been lost to los USB drives or forgotten passwords, etc that a government would never know how many are still in legit wallets. Plus satoshi has a million..
- XR0CSWV3h3kZWg 9y ago
  You have third party risk. Right now for most developed countries third party risk has never been lower, but it's still there. A recent example was the bank of cyprus in 2013. If a third party controls your assets then those assets are under greater risk.
Havoc 9y ago
> the use cases above That exactly is my point. You list usage cases - but nobody is USING it. Unless there is a meteoric increase in real world usage (i.e. non speculative) to match the valuations the whole crypto world is going to have a very ugly surprise. You know what's a sure sign of a bubble? When people not even remotely in that world start asking me about this bitcoin thing - they heard it only goes up and it's easy money. Zero notion as to what it is beyond that. How's that for price discovery?

tomcart 9y ago

> How many people want to buy gold but don't want to have third party trust with an organization that holds gold or have to hold it themselves. How is this different with Bitcoin? Edit: by which i mean, either you work out what do do with the key, or you trust an exchange/online wallet provider to do it for you.

russdpale 9y ago
Well because gold is heavy and large and tough to hide.
- XR0CSWV3h3kZWg 9y ago
  Also divide and prove purity. Both are trivial for bitcoin.

rhino369 9y ago

Why would someone be afraid of a Gold ETF that you can buy with a free e-trade account but invest money in online monopoly money?

russdpale 9y ago
Because the government can very easily seize your etf? They could even physically confiscate the gold rendering your note useless. This equivalent is logistically impossible with bitcoin and the more nodes the stronger it becomes to resisting censorship. They would literally have to buy every single bitcoin (probably at tremendous price increase) and throw away the private key. Even leaving just 1 satoshi would render this plan completely useless. And because around %15 or so of the bitcoins have been lost to los USB drives or forgotten passwords, etc that a government would never know how many are still in legit wallets. Plus satoshi has a million..
XR0CSWV3h3kZWg 9y ago
You have third party risk. Right now for most developed countries third party risk has never been lower, but it's still there. A recent example was the bank of cyprus in 2013. If a third party controls your assets then those assets are under greater risk.

Havoc 9y ago

> the use cases above That exactly is my point. You list usage cases - but nobody is USING it. Unless there is a meteoric increase in real world usage (i.e. non speculative) to match the valuations the whole crypto world is going to have a very ugly surprise. You know what's a sure sign of a bubble? When people not even remotely in that world start asking me about this bitcoin thing - they heard it only goes up and it's easy money. Zero notion as to what it is beyond that. How's that for price discovery?