5 ms·

Receiving stolen property is a crime. Edit: or not in this case, my bad.

microcolonel 9y ago
At least in England, Wales, Northern Ireland, the Republic of Ireland, the United States of America, and Canada, knowing that the property was stolen or otherwise obtained by crime is an essential element of the crime.
- QAPereo 9y ago
  If this person is buying art from the unlisted web, if they're not going to be able to prove provenance... what do you think they're going to be able to say? "Oh gee, I knew it was stolen when I went to the "dark web" to buy it, and it's a well-known stolen piece, but I had no idea that I was receiving stolen property!" It's not like buying something from e-bay, and it turns out the seller boosted it from a van; that is not your fault.
  - microcolonel 9y ago
    > If this person is buying art from the unlisted web, if they're not going to be able to prove provenance. I think you may have lost track of the thread here. I was addressing this question posed by gtsteve. > And perhaps in a few generations, the heirs of that wealthy person could sell it on. I don't really know how it works if you discover you've inherited property that was stolen a hundred years ago for example. At what point does it become yours? It is obviously unlawful to traffick knowingly in stolen goods. It is as serious a crime as the theft itself (sans aggravating factors like use of force or intimidation, especially with a deadly weapon).
    - QAPereo 9y ago
      I did indeed lose track, thanks for pointing that out so gently.
      - deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
- FRex 9y ago
  This may vary significantly by country. In Poland the Art. 292 of Criminal Code and Art. 122 of Misdemeanor Code says something like "an item, about which on the basis of accompanying circumstances should and may be suspected that it has been procured by an illegal act" and directly addressed accidental fencing of an item (Art. 291 and 121 respectively address intentional/knowingly fencing an item). I have no idea how that works in practice but googling "accidental fencing" in Polish ("nieświadome paserstwo") brings up a few results about people who bought cheap stuff online and it turned out to be stolen. Here's one case like that with a lawyer's answer/opinion if you want to try Google page translate or can read Polish: https://www.eporady24.pl/nieswiadome_paserstwo,pytania,6,64,13331.html https://www.eporady24.pl/nieswiadome_paserstwo,pytania,6,64,...
  - tryingagainbro 9y ago
    Doesn't matter much. Say, Spain prosecutes, a court rules it stolen and the Polish govt has to recognize the ruling and return the painting. If it's stolen and the government is after you (in this they will), you're toast.

At least in England, Wales, Northern Ireland, the Republic of Ireland, the United States of America, and Canada, knowing that the property was stolen or otherwise obtained by crime is an essential element of the crime.

QAPereo 9y ago
If this person is buying art from the unlisted web, if they're not going to be able to prove provenance... what do you think they're going to be able to say? "Oh gee, I knew it was stolen when I went to the "dark web" to buy it, and it's a well-known stolen piece, but I had no idea that I was receiving stolen property!" It's not like buying something from e-bay, and it turns out the seller boosted it from a van; that is not your fault.
- microcolonel 9y ago
  > If this person is buying art from the unlisted web, if they're not going to be able to prove provenance. I think you may have lost track of the thread here. I was addressing this question posed by gtsteve. > And perhaps in a few generations, the heirs of that wealthy person could sell it on. I don't really know how it works if you discover you've inherited property that was stolen a hundred years ago for example. At what point does it become yours? It is obviously unlawful to traffick knowingly in stolen goods. It is as serious a crime as the theft itself (sans aggravating factors like use of force or intimidation, especially with a deadly weapon).
  - QAPereo 9y ago
    I did indeed lose track, thanks for pointing that out so gently.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
FRex 9y ago
This may vary significantly by country. In Poland the Art. 292 of Criminal Code and Art. 122 of Misdemeanor Code says something like "an item, about which on the basis of accompanying circumstances should and may be suspected that it has been procured by an illegal act" and directly addressed accidental fencing of an item (Art. 291 and 121 respectively address intentional/knowingly fencing an item). I have no idea how that works in practice but googling "accidental fencing" in Polish ("nieświadome paserstwo") brings up a few results about people who bought cheap stuff online and it turned out to be stolen. Here's one case like that with a lawyer's answer/opinion if you want to try Google page translate or can read Polish: https://www.eporady24.pl/nieswiadome_paserstwo,pytania,6,64,13331.html https://www.eporady24.pl/nieswiadome_paserstwo,pytania,6,64,...
- tryingagainbro 9y ago
  Doesn't matter much. Say, Spain prosecutes, a court rules it stolen and the Polish govt has to recognize the ruling and return the painting. If it's stolen and the government is after you (in this they will), you're toast.