6 ms·

The churn rate is also high on most software teams. In some cases, successful companies struggle to find candidates because all the good people have worked ther

The churn rate is also high on most software teams. In some cases, successful companies struggle to find candidates because all the good people have worked there before and ran away. One of the brightest developers I've worked with quit after 3 weeks at my company because they were underpaying her and wouldn't give her a raise. This same company complained regularly of not being able to find good talent. Employers think they hold all the leverage and can treat developers how they want. They really don't. Why do you think half of software projects fail to deliver?

sidlls 9y ago
> Why do you think half of software projects fail to deliver? A number of reasons: 1. Bikeshedding over the tech stack 2. A glut of CS grads who see a bunch of nails to hit with their textbook and data structures and algorithms knowledge failing to engage in a proper engineering process 3. Poorly defined requirements (blame aplenty to go around here: product development giving insufficient thought to the product details, sales over promising, and "engineers" failing to contribute by treating partnering with these folks as an onerous chore rather than a necessary task) 4. Insufficient resources And many more, I'm sure. Developers aren't blameless, here. In fact over the last couple of years I've come to see them as being at least as much to blame as non-technical people, perhaps even more so.
Consultant32452 9y ago
>quit after 3 weeks at my company because they were underpaying her and wouldn't give her a raise. Why would she have accepted an offer she felt was too low?
- tboyd47 9y ago
  Why wouldn't she? Maybe she wanted to get her foot in the door. The point I'm trying to make is that the company needed her more than she needed them.
  - Consultant32452 9y ago
    >Why wouldn't she? Because it's unethical to agree to work for a rate you're not actually willing to work for. She wasted a lot of people's time and resources to bring her on board for those three weeks. >The point I'm trying to make is that the company needed her more than she needed them. I wouldn't want to work with a person who accepts an offer and then THREE WEEKS later starts demanding raises, no matter what their skill level.
    - deleted 9y ago
      [deleted]
    - tboyd47 9y ago
      Like I said, maybe she knew her worth and just wanted to get her foot in the door. I never said she asked for a raise. She just found a better offer elsewhere, and probably would had stayed for the right counteroffer. I wouldn't want to work with a person who puts their own ideas about when it's appropriate to expect a raise over keeping bright people. She didn't waste anyone's time; unlike most, she was productive from day one to the day she left. The company was wasting their own time by optimizing for low compensation and not engineering acumen. Companies have no problem staffing projects they know will be canceled soon, or projects that are underfunded. It's a dog eat dog world, I'm afraid.
      - heimidal 9y ago
        Counteroffers are widely regarded as a terrible thing to offer -- it sets a precedent that anyone, at any time, can attempt to hold your company hostage for more money. Most organizations with much industry experience will pass on any sort of counteroffer. And it's likely that she _absolutely did_ waste people's time -- the company may have passed on other candidates to hire her and had to start over.
        deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
        9y ago

sidlls 9y ago

> Why do you think half of software projects fail to deliver? A number of reasons: 1. Bikeshedding over the tech stack 2. A glut of CS grads who see a bunch of nails to hit with their textbook and data structures and algorithms knowledge failing to engage in a proper engineering process 3. Poorly defined requirements (blame aplenty to go around here: product development giving insufficient thought to the product details, sales over promising, and "engineers" failing to contribute by treating partnering with these folks as an onerous chore rather than a necessary task) 4. Insufficient resources And many more, I'm sure. Developers aren't blameless, here. In fact over the last couple of years I've come to see them as being at least as much to blame as non-technical people, perhaps even more so.

Consultant32452 9y ago

>quit after 3 weeks at my company because they were underpaying her and wouldn't give her a raise. Why would she have accepted an offer she felt was too low?

tboyd47 9y ago
Why wouldn't she? Maybe she wanted to get her foot in the door. The point I'm trying to make is that the company needed her more than she needed them.
- Consultant32452 9y ago
  >Why wouldn't she? Because it's unethical to agree to work for a rate you're not actually willing to work for. She wasted a lot of people's time and resources to bring her on board for those three weeks. >The point I'm trying to make is that the company needed her more than she needed them. I wouldn't want to work with a person who accepts an offer and then THREE WEEKS later starts demanding raises, no matter what their skill level.
  - deleted 9y ago
    [deleted]
  - tboyd47 9y ago
    Like I said, maybe she knew her worth and just wanted to get her foot in the door. I never said she asked for a raise. She just found a better offer elsewhere, and probably would had stayed for the right counteroffer. I wouldn't want to work with a person who puts their own ideas about when it's appropriate to expect a raise over keeping bright people. She didn't waste anyone's time; unlike most, she was productive from day one to the day she left. The company was wasting their own time by optimizing for low compensation and not engineering acumen. Companies have no problem staffing projects they know will be canceled soon, or projects that are underfunded. It's a dog eat dog world, I'm afraid.
    - heimidal 9y ago
      Counteroffers are widely regarded as a terrible thing to offer -- it sets a precedent that anyone, at any time, can attempt to hold your company hostage for more money. Most organizations with much industry experience will pass on any sort of counteroffer. And it's likely that she _absolutely did_ waste people's time -- the company may have passed on other candidates to hire her and had to start over.
      - deleted 9y ago
        [deleted]
      - 9y ago