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But on the other hand, Tesla already has a few notable sensor failures, the biggest one being the fatal crash when the sensors failed to see a semi truck at 90

by jaxbot 9y ago

But on the other hand, Tesla already has a few notable sensor failures, the biggest one being the fatal crash when the sensors failed to see a semi truck at 90 degrees to path of travel (or cancelled it out as noise, etc.) Obviously things improve with time, but Tesla has never convinced me of having a robust pipeline for validating their sensors/AI projects. Everything they release feels like someone said "well, it's good enough for how much we're willing to spend." Notably, their refusal to evaluate LIDAR when every other company is banking on it.

dewski 9y ago
You don’t think Tesla evaluated LIDAR at all? I’m sure they did preliminary tests to confirm or deny what they could and couldn’t do with it. Considering every car produced by Tesla in the last two years has Autopilot, I think their pipeline is pretty great at gathering data for every car and performing tests against the data they gather.
- tqkxzugoaupvwqr 9y ago
  LIDAR sensors are expensive. I wouldn’t be surprised if Tesla stopped evaluating them right there and thought, looking at the price of regular camera sensors, “Well, humans have two RGB cameras in their head and seem to do just fine. We can replicate that!”.
saulrh 9y ago
As a counterpoint, I personally have had a few notable sensor failures, culminating in an incident when I was 17 that convinced me that I was not safe to operate motor vehicles. No injuries or damage, but I still don't own a car, and my decision is reaffirmed every time I catch a ride from someone and try to follow along to see how it goes. You may have experienced fewer sensor failures than you've seen Teslas having in the news. But... you're exactly one person, and you're hearing the news about every "sensor failure" that Tesla has had in the entire world. And beyond that, a sensor failure is defined as an event that you don't experience. How many times have you only avoided death by pure chance? Tesla's "notable sensor failures" are literally an every-day occurrence for the mark-one eyeball. The semi crash you're talking about? Humans do exactly that with such regularity that the EU mandates guard rails under the beds of semi trailers. The difference is that, for Tesla's "sensor failures", obviously things improve with time. You think that humans do the same? Our cars are better, signage and visibility technology are better, but I guarantee you that today's drivers are, in aggregate, the same dumb-ass teenagers that they have been for the last hundred years. And that's why I support Tesla. We can argue forever about whether they're safer than humans today, because driving is such a personal thing that nobody is willing to disentangle their anecdotes from data, but it is obvious that automated vehicles will be safer than humans in the near future. Possibly the very near future.
greglindahl 9y ago
How'd you figure out Tesla refused to evaluate LIDAR? And if they did, what's the model S with LIDAR that's been spotted near Tesla's Palo Alto HQ doing? https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-lidar-sensors-spotted-testing-palo-alto/ https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-lidar-sensors-spotted-testin...

by jaxbot 9y ago

dewski 9y ago

You don’t think Tesla evaluated LIDAR at all? I’m sure they did preliminary tests to confirm or deny what they could and couldn’t do with it. Considering every car produced by Tesla in the last two years has Autopilot, I think their pipeline is pretty great at gathering data for every car and performing tests against the data they gather.

tqkxzugoaupvwqr 9y ago
LIDAR sensors are expensive. I wouldn’t be surprised if Tesla stopped evaluating them right there and thought, looking at the price of regular camera sensors, “Well, humans have two RGB cameras in their head and seem to do just fine. We can replicate that!”.

saulrh 9y ago

As a counterpoint, I personally have had a few notable sensor failures, culminating in an incident when I was 17 that convinced me that I was not safe to operate motor vehicles. No injuries or damage, but I still don't own a car, and my decision is reaffirmed every time I catch a ride from someone and try to follow along to see how it goes. You may have experienced fewer sensor failures than you've seen Teslas having in the news. But... you're exactly one person, and you're hearing the news about every "sensor failure" that Tesla has had in the entire world. And beyond that, a sensor failure is defined as an event that you don't experience. How many times have you only avoided death by pure chance? Tesla's "notable sensor failures" are literally an every-day occurrence for the mark-one eyeball. The semi crash you're talking about? Humans do exactly that with such regularity that the EU mandates guard rails under the beds of semi trailers. The difference is that, for Tesla's "sensor failures", obviously things improve with time. You think that humans do the same? Our cars are better, signage and visibility technology are better, but I guarantee you that today's drivers are, in aggregate, the same dumb-ass teenagers that they have been for the last hundred years. And that's why I support Tesla. We can argue forever about whether they're safer than humans today, because driving is such a personal thing that nobody is willing to disentangle their anecdotes from data, but it is obvious that automated vehicles will be safer than humans in the near future. Possibly the very near future.

greglindahl 9y ago

How'd you figure out Tesla refused to evaluate LIDAR? And if they did, what's the model S with LIDAR that's been spotted near Tesla's Palo Alto HQ doing? https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-lidar-sensors-spotted-testing-palo-alto/ https://www.teslarati.com/tesla-lidar-sensors-spotted-testin...