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Trump isn't "reprehensible", his actions are literally killing people. People who agree with Trump either directly condone the deaths of people, or are so igno

Trump isn't "reprehensible", his actions are literally killing people. People who agree with Trump either directly condone the deaths of people, or are so ignorant that nothing they could say would be valuable. Trying to portray it as "opposing political opinions" is a laughable insult to people for whom it's a matter of survival.

dogma1138 9y ago
Same goes for every other president. Obama extended the drone program considerably because to him it was a convenient way of both “keeping” his promises and maintaining US political and security interests. Does that means that everyone who voted for him and agreed with most of his policies directly condoned deaths of far more people than what Trump’s policies at least currently may have contributed too? Every US president and a few other world leaders would end up killing people through both direct and indirect actions. But in all honesty this isn’t what this discussion is about. “Trump killing people” is effectively the new Poe’s law, it’s a statement that doesn’t have any meaningful substance behind it and it’s only goal is to end the discussion.
- Mithaldu 9y ago
  Ah, another "there's both good and bad people on both sides" sentiment. No. Quantitative analysis matters. Also, as to your last sentence: "same goes for *" doesn't have any meaningful substance behind it and its only goal is to drag the discussion out so far as to exhaust the other side into giving up.
  - dogma1138 9y ago
    Let’s make it simple then. How many people do you think have died due to Trumps policies so far, out of those how many of them are Americans?
    - mrgordon 9y ago
      Not a great argument. Most of Trump's policies like expanding use of coal and not taking actions to prevent flooding and other consequences of global warming will be felt in 10, 20, or maybe even 50 years. By reversing course and burying the facts, he is still responsible for them in a way that Obama (who tried to work on the problem) was not. Even more directly, Trump is in the process of gutting our healthcare, education, and taxes (read: infrastructure). If he had a few more votes in the Senate, they would have already undermined/removed even more of our social safety net. Millions of people will have significantly worse quality of life and for many of them it will mean the difference between life and death. Their medicines will get too expensive...they won't be able to afford to see a doctor in some cases...or get surgery or chemo in many more. To say that Trump's policies aren't killing people (and especially Americans) is to ignore anything but soldiers from the count. Obama largely inherited Bush Jr's wars (and Bush Jr. was largely continuing Bush Sr's wars) so you're welcome to blame him for the deaths there but he probably had fewer options than you imply. Not to say he did nothing wrong, but Trump is literally threatening to nuke North Korea which is orders of magnitude different from how Obama acted even once in eight years.
      - dogma1138 9y ago
        It is, because the original poster said that for the people who are dying now because of his actions it’s a life and death situation. I want to know who are these people. Don’t get me wrong I agree with you on most things, that said I don’t actually see the US being much worse on climate change than under previous administrations they are just louder and more obnoxious about it (which ironically might actually push things for the better). My problem is that I’ve seen too many people who claim trump is literally killing people and they don’t mean people in Bangladesh that might die to future floods due to climate change. They usually would say “Trump is killing a minority/political_group_x” and those statements are pretty darn baseless, actually I take that back, he's definitely killing the republican party and also the center democrats.
        Mithaldu 9y ago
        I never said "now". And the post previous is right. Climate change is the big one. It affects the entire planet. However the, for a better word, desocialization of the USA is also a big factor both inside the country, and outside of it due to people who associate with or are relatives of americans being affected, or resources that would be used to help improve situations in other countries being tied up with emergencies in-country that would otherwise be handled by funds that are now going to tax breaks. Then there's also the situation in Yemen which the USA is indirectly responsible for. And there's the situation in Puerto Rico, which is nominally american, but i think if a people don't get to vote, they get to be counted as a different country.

dogma1138 9y ago

Same goes for every other president. Obama extended the drone program considerably because to him it was a convenient way of both “keeping” his promises and maintaining US political and security interests. Does that means that everyone who voted for him and agreed with most of his policies directly condoned deaths of far more people than what Trump’s policies at least currently may have contributed too? Every US president and a few other world leaders would end up killing people through both direct and indirect actions. But in all honesty this isn’t what this discussion is about. “Trump killing people” is effectively the new Poe’s law, it’s a statement that doesn’t have any meaningful substance behind it and it’s only goal is to end the discussion.

Mithaldu 9y ago
Ah, another "there's both good and bad people on both sides" sentiment. No. Quantitative analysis matters. Also, as to your last sentence: "same goes for *" doesn't have any meaningful substance behind it and its only goal is to drag the discussion out so far as to exhaust the other side into giving up.
- dogma1138 9y ago
  Let’s make it simple then. How many people do you think have died due to Trumps policies so far, out of those how many of them are Americans?
  - mrgordon 9y ago
    Not a great argument. Most of Trump's policies like expanding use of coal and not taking actions to prevent flooding and other consequences of global warming will be felt in 10, 20, or maybe even 50 years. By reversing course and burying the facts, he is still responsible for them in a way that Obama (who tried to work on the problem) was not. Even more directly, Trump is in the process of gutting our healthcare, education, and taxes (read: infrastructure). If he had a few more votes in the Senate, they would have already undermined/removed even more of our social safety net. Millions of people will have significantly worse quality of life and for many of them it will mean the difference between life and death. Their medicines will get too expensive...they won't be able to afford to see a doctor in some cases...or get surgery or chemo in many more. To say that Trump's policies aren't killing people (and especially Americans) is to ignore anything but soldiers from the count. Obama largely inherited Bush Jr's wars (and Bush Jr. was largely continuing Bush Sr's wars) so you're welcome to blame him for the deaths there but he probably had fewer options than you imply. Not to say he did nothing wrong, but Trump is literally threatening to nuke North Korea which is orders of magnitude different from how Obama acted even once in eight years.
    - dogma1138 9y ago
      It is, because the original poster said that for the people who are dying now because of his actions it’s a life and death situation. I want to know who are these people. Don’t get me wrong I agree with you on most things, that said I don’t actually see the US being much worse on climate change than under previous administrations they are just louder and more obnoxious about it (which ironically might actually push things for the better). My problem is that I’ve seen too many people who claim trump is literally killing people and they don’t mean people in Bangladesh that might die to future floods due to climate change. They usually would say “Trump is killing a minority/political_group_x” and those statements are pretty darn baseless, actually I take that back, he's definitely killing the republican party and also the center democrats.
      - Mithaldu 9y ago
        I never said "now". And the post previous is right. Climate change is the big one. It affects the entire planet. However the, for a better word, desocialization of the USA is also a big factor both inside the country, and outside of it due to people who associate with or are relatives of americans being affected, or resources that would be used to help improve situations in other countries being tied up with emergencies in-country that would otherwise be handled by funds that are now going to tax breaks. Then there's also the situation in Yemen which the USA is indirectly responsible for. And there's the situation in Puerto Rico, which is nominally american, but i think if a people don't get to vote, they get to be counted as a different country.