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Haven't the courts already decided that if things can be done by hand then they can be automated? For example license plate scanners were ruled legal because of

by lovich 9y ago

Haven't the courts already decided that if things can be done by hand then they can be automated? For example license plate scanners were ruled legal because officers can view that information in public, but the automation allows the police to follow everyones movements with only a few machines set up. This ship has sailed

epicide 9y ago
You're probably correct in how it will turn out, but laws can change. One precedent does not mean nothing will ever break it. It does make it harder, though.
mtgx 9y ago
On the other hand the Supreme Court ruled 9-0 that "just because law enforcement can follow someone manually" doesn't mean it can also put a GPS tracker on whoever it wants, without a warrant. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-police-gps/supreme-court-rules-police-need-warrant-for-gps-tracking-idUSTRE80M1E120120124 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-police-gps/supreme-co... I think we as the society are ultimately responsible for setting certain "rights" in stone. For instance, should the government be able to record everything anyone says "in a public place", even while on the phone or having a "private conversation" (but in public) with a friend, through highly advanced CCTV cameras? Sure you could argue that "because it's a public place, then yes, we can conclude that the government should be allowed to do that". But that doesn't necessarily have to end the discussion. We, the society, can decide that "HELL NO, that's not acceptable, and we'll put anyone who tries to do that in prison."
matt4077 9y ago
Automated license plate scanning is probably legal for local municipalities (Neil v Fairfax County, SC appeal pending). That doesn't mean it's legal for private entities to do so, nor is necessarily legal for such data to be, for example, aggregated nation-wide. See https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2014/02/mass-surveillance-of-all-car-trips-is-nearly-upon-us/283922/ https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2014/02/mass-su... for Conor Friedersdorf's article which is attributed with bringing down the last attempt for a "Homeland Security" database of where you were last summer.
- mjevans 9y ago
  The correct solution for this concern is to make it legal to obscure the IDENTIFYING part of the license plates (but require that state and 'tabs' are still exposed) while it is parked. Moving the obscurity would constitute modification of private property and should require either a valid documented probable cause or a warrant for the search.

by lovich 9y ago

epicide 9y ago

You're probably correct in how it will turn out, but laws can change. One precedent does not mean nothing will ever break it. It does make it harder, though.

mtgx 9y ago

On the other hand the Supreme Court ruled 9-0 that "just because law enforcement can follow someone manually" doesn't mean it can also put a GPS tracker on whoever it wants, without a warrant. https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-police-gps/supreme-court-rules-police-need-warrant-for-gps-tracking-idUSTRE80M1E120120124 https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-police-gps/supreme-co... I think we as the society are ultimately responsible for setting certain "rights" in stone. For instance, should the government be able to record everything anyone says "in a public place", even while on the phone or having a "private conversation" (but in public) with a friend, through highly advanced CCTV cameras? Sure you could argue that "because it's a public place, then yes, we can conclude that the government should be allowed to do that". But that doesn't necessarily have to end the discussion. We, the society, can decide that "HELL NO, that's not acceptable, and we'll put anyone who tries to do that in prison."

matt4077 9y ago

Automated license plate scanning is probably legal for local municipalities (Neil v Fairfax County, SC appeal pending). That doesn't mean it's legal for private entities to do so, nor is necessarily legal for such data to be, for example, aggregated nation-wide. See https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2014/02/mass-surveillance-of-all-car-trips-is-nearly-upon-us/283922/ https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2014/02/mass-su... for Conor Friedersdorf's article which is attributed with bringing down the last attempt for a "Homeland Security" database of where you were last summer.

mjevans 9y ago
The correct solution for this concern is to make it legal to obscure the IDENTIFYING part of the license plates (but require that state and 'tabs' are still exposed) while it is parked. Moving the obscurity would constitute modification of private property and should require either a valid documented probable cause or a warrant for the search.