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people will stop working or spend the money on some wasteful way That's not really the argument. What does matter is where does the money come from. Cf Thes

people will stop working or spend the money on some wasteful way That's not really the argument. What does matter is where does the money come from. Cf These handout incomes are to be given as "an absolute constitutional right," and not to be withheld "under any circumstances." This means that the recipients are to continue to get this income not only if they absolutely refuse to seek or take a job, but if they throw the handout money away at the races, or spend it on prostitutes, on whiskey, cigarettes, marijuana, heroin, or what not. They are to be given "sufficient to live in dignity," and it is apparently to be no business of the taxpayers if a recipient chooses none the less to live without dignity, and to devote his guaranteed leisure to gambling, dissipation, drunkenness, debauchery, dope addiction, or a life of crime https://fee.org/articles/income-without-work/ https://fee.org/articles/income-without-work/

shkkmo 9y ago
Your claim is contradicted by your quotes which specifically calls out people not working and spending their money wastefully.
- ttoinou 9y ago
  Then you did not understand the quote. It's not about an objective morality (what is shameful, wasteful etc. to spend on). Spend the money you successfully exchanged with someone else the way you want it. The morale case with the argument is that citizen should have their say in how their taxes are spend, and that each of one us have different goals so "living in dignity" cannot be accomplished by UBI.
  - shkkmo 9y ago
    > Then you did not understand the quote. Perhaps you picked a bad quote then. That quote pretty explicitly contradicts your claim.
    - ttoinou 9y ago
      They are to be given "sufficient to live in dignity," and it is apparently to be no business of the taxpayers if a recipient chooses none the less to live without dignity Dignity is subjective ofc. If you think otherwise I can understand how you can interpret the quote in another way :)
      - shkkmo 9y ago
        Since dignity is subjective, how can someone (the taxpayer) have any business having an opinion on whether someone else is living with dignity? I fail to see how the subjectivity of dignity has any relation to your claim that "What does matter is where does the money come from."
        ttoinou 9y ago
        They don't have business in it. But they might find how their taxes are spent immoral from their point of view. UBI will never solve the economic problem of "we all should be living in dignity", ours values are subjective.

shkkmo 9y ago

Your claim is contradicted by your quotes which specifically calls out people not working and spending their money wastefully.

ttoinou 9y ago
Then you did not understand the quote. It's not about an objective morality (what is shameful, wasteful etc. to spend on). Spend the money you successfully exchanged with someone else the way you want it. The morale case with the argument is that citizen should have their say in how their taxes are spend, and that each of one us have different goals so "living in dignity" cannot be accomplished by UBI.
- shkkmo 9y ago
  > Then you did not understand the quote. Perhaps you picked a bad quote then. That quote pretty explicitly contradicts your claim.
  - ttoinou 9y ago
    They are to be given "sufficient to live in dignity," and it is apparently to be no business of the taxpayers if a recipient chooses none the less to live without dignity Dignity is subjective ofc. If you think otherwise I can understand how you can interpret the quote in another way :)
    - shkkmo 9y ago
      Since dignity is subjective, how can someone (the taxpayer) have any business having an opinion on whether someone else is living with dignity? I fail to see how the subjectivity of dignity has any relation to your claim that "What does matter is where does the money come from."
      - ttoinou 9y ago
        They don't have business in it. But they might find how their taxes are spent immoral from their point of view. UBI will never solve the economic problem of "we all should be living in dignity", ours values are subjective.