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Bitcoin Cash has Surpassed Bitcoin in global hashrate [Nov 13 2017]

31 points by bwasti 9y ago

cheeze 9y ago
Isn't the difficulty the same? Why wouldn't you want to mine whichever coin cost more?
- detaro 9y ago
  No, it's not the same, since they are completely separate now and run the difficulty adjustment independently.
sputknick 9y ago
According to this site the average transaction fee for Bitcoin right now is $19.20! I'm not sure what is going to happen long term, but it's interesting to watch from the sidelines as this situation evolves.
debacle 9y ago
As someone out of the loop, why do the series have noted periods where the rates have inverse extrema, starting with Oct 1?
- lightbyte 9y ago
  I'd guess that it is large pools of miners switching over together.
- dnadler 9y ago
  It's probably miners switching between the two depending on which is more profitable at the time.
- elif 9y ago
  the difficulty of BCH is about 35% that of BTC. so blocks are generated faster if given the same hashrate. That makes BCH profitable to mine even at a fraction of the market price. This flip of "profitability" has miners chasing the most $/second. Mining pools even have automatic switches that change networks depending upon the current network state. The original difficulty algorithm is very slow, and the BCH "EDA" difficulty algorithm is predictably chaotic in a way that guarantees these immediate extremes of profitability vs unprofitability. It is being patched with a stable 144 block average presently (the next block at time of writing), at which point the swings will not be as extreme. The reason it started around Oct. is because the price of BTC had historically made BCH unprofitable at almost any difficulty, but a positive BCH price swing has changed that.
russelldc 9y ago
That graph is many hours behind. https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate The hashrate quickly jumped back to Bitcoin after the difficulty changed.
gressquel 9y ago
No it hasnt. this is fake news. https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate Bitcoin cash was momentarily ahead of bitcoin, but now the order has been restored.
- gressquel 9y ago
  also one more thing. Bitcoin cash is a altcoin backed by some dubious people: -Some swedish guy who claims he is the CEO of bitcoin cash. Who is also a pirate party member -Roger ver, who has been kicked out of US after serving jailtime. -Wright, a guy who impersonated satoshi nakamoto and was exposed + alot more. these people want to take control of bitcoin and make it a centralized currency.
  - jettybrew 9y ago
    Since when does someone get kicked out of the US for having gone to jail?
    - gressquel 9y ago
      sorry.. my mistake. I meant kicked out of US after serving jailtime.
    - elif 9y ago
      he defected for political reasons. Since he has over $150M+ of bitcoin now, it was a $22M-worth idea.
  - kirillseva 9y ago
    + Bitmain, the largest ASIC manufacturer and the only reason why BCH fork ever happened in the first place
  - aqme28 9y ago
    It's a distributed system. What do you mean by "backed"? I'm sure there are some ex-felon proponents of BTC as well.
lend000 9y ago
It was short lived, much like the battle between ETC and ETH. You can see the updated hash-rates here: https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate This might equalize with BCH's fork today, which will give them a free difficulty adjustment.
- jaequery 9y ago
  what time is the fork happening?
- smokeyj 9y ago
  There really wasn't a ETC ETH battle. BCH is currently trading about 1/5 of BTC and was briefly #2 in market cap.
babaganoosh89 9y ago
The difficulty rate fluctuates depending on how many people are mining it. Sometimes BCC is more profitable to mine and everyone piles into it. Then the difficulty goes up and all the miners go back to BTC. Doesn't really mean much.
- elif 9y ago
  Well, it means something since the BCH fork is capable of handling wild mining fluctuations, but the BTC chain is crippled by them. It can't keep happening.
kirillseva 9y ago
that's because it's more profitable to mine BCH now before the difficulty adjustment kicks in. Didn't they recently hard fork to relax the difficulty adjustment rules so this exact situation could happen? Alternatively Bitmain has just plugged in a new batch of their ASICBoost
tfha 9y ago
This was achieved by paying miners substantially more. That payment gets pulled out of the Bitcoin Cash market cap when the miners sell their coins. This news is essentially equivalent to saying "On November 13th, Salesforce outspent Apple in cyber security. This is one of just a few days in all of history where the security spending for that day for Salesforce exceeded the security spending of Apple for that day. Apple is expected to fall into a death spiral soon."
- elif 9y ago
  "During which time, apple was only able to spend 5% of their normal security expenses"
throw401 9y ago
I hope this will eventually happen with bitcoingold. Bitcoin and bitcoincash should have never been allowed to be mineable with ASIC's. For now it's still Bitmain's game.
stale2002 9y ago
For those who are unaware, Bitcoin Cash is a fork of the bitcoin network (NOT an alt coin). Over the years, there have been two conflicting visions for what Bitcoin should be. The Core development team what Bitcoin to be digital gold settlement layer. A censorship resistent store of value for settling low volume, multi thousand dollar transactions, that costs hundreds of dollars per transaction. This is because the higher transaction fees are, the higher the "security" of the network is. The other, competing vision for Bitcoin, and Bitcoin Cash, is that it should be a way for every day people to make every day transactions. They believe that fees per transaction should be measured in cents, at most. This vision sacrifices some amount of security, in order to allow mass adoption. There are more complicated arguments, such as mythical "layer 2 and layer 3" solutions, called the lightning network, that could be deployed on the network, so as to help with scalability. But these solutions are perpetually 18 months away from completion. Mostly recently, the settlement layer, high fees faction "won" by stopping one of attempted upgrades to the network, and the other side responded by forking the network and going its own way. That is Bitcoin Cash.
- pierrebonbon 9y ago
  Bcash is just another altcoin. The sole reason for the existence of Bitcoin Cash is pump and dump + (covert) ASICBOOST by Bitmain (largest chinese ASIC manufacturer) leading to greater centralization and an unfair advantage. Please take some time to read: https://medium.com/@WhalePanda/asicboost-the-reason-why-bitmain-blocked-segwit-901fd346ee9f https://medium.com/@WhalePanda/asicboost-the-reason-why-bitm... Besides that, Lightning Network can be deployed much quicker. In fact, it already runs on testnet e.g.: https://github.com/LN-Zap/zap-desktop https://github.com/LN-Zap/zap-desktop / https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhpg_8D2FPI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhpg_8D2FPI So how is bitcoin core going to scale ? Take a look at this: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/7cn5dj/so_how_is_bitcoin_going_to_scale/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/7cn5dj/so_how_is_b... (Schnorr, RSK, Segwit, Lightning and more)
  - stale2002 9y ago
    Segwit has been active for 3 months, and average blocksize is around 1.05 MB. So in 3 whole months, segwit has scaled the network by a measly 5%. All the stuff you are talking about will likely end the same way.
jettybrew 9y ago
Here's a good article on the recent situation: https://fee.org/articles/a-beginner-s-guide-to-bitcoin-chaos/ https://fee.org/articles/a-beginner-s-guide-to-bitcoin-chaos...
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kjullien 9y ago
yeah btc miners flooded with their hashrate to make profit off btc crash because of seg2x

31 points by bwasti 9y ago

cheeze 9y ago

Isn't the difficulty the same? Why wouldn't you want to mine whichever coin cost more?

detaro 9y ago
No, it's not the same, since they are completely separate now and run the difficulty adjustment independently.

sputknick 9y ago

According to this site the average transaction fee for Bitcoin right now is $19.20! I'm not sure what is going to happen long term, but it's interesting to watch from the sidelines as this situation evolves.

debacle 9y ago

As someone out of the loop, why do the series have noted periods where the rates have inverse extrema, starting with Oct 1?

lightbyte 9y ago
I'd guess that it is large pools of miners switching over together.
dnadler 9y ago
It's probably miners switching between the two depending on which is more profitable at the time.
elif 9y ago
the difficulty of BCH is about 35% that of BTC. so blocks are generated faster if given the same hashrate. That makes BCH profitable to mine even at a fraction of the market price. This flip of "profitability" has miners chasing the most $/second. Mining pools even have automatic switches that change networks depending upon the current network state. The original difficulty algorithm is very slow, and the BCH "EDA" difficulty algorithm is predictably chaotic in a way that guarantees these immediate extremes of profitability vs unprofitability. It is being patched with a stable 144 block average presently (the next block at time of writing), at which point the swings will not be as extreme. The reason it started around Oct. is because the price of BTC had historically made BCH unprofitable at almost any difficulty, but a positive BCH price swing has changed that.

russelldc 9y ago

That graph is many hours behind. https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate The hashrate quickly jumped back to Bitcoin after the difficulty changed.

gressquel 9y ago

No it hasnt. this is fake news. https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate Bitcoin cash was momentarily ahead of bitcoin, but now the order has been restored.

gressquel 9y ago
also one more thing. Bitcoin cash is a altcoin backed by some dubious people: -Some swedish guy who claims he is the CEO of bitcoin cash. Who is also a pirate party member -Roger ver, who has been kicked out of US after serving jailtime. -Wright, a guy who impersonated satoshi nakamoto and was exposed + alot more. these people want to take control of bitcoin and make it a centralized currency.
- jettybrew 9y ago
  Since when does someone get kicked out of the US for having gone to jail?
  - gressquel 9y ago
    sorry.. my mistake. I meant kicked out of US after serving jailtime.
  - elif 9y ago
    he defected for political reasons. Since he has over $150M+ of bitcoin now, it was a $22M-worth idea.
- kirillseva 9y ago
  + Bitmain, the largest ASIC manufacturer and the only reason why BCH fork ever happened in the first place
- aqme28 9y ago
  It's a distributed system. What do you mean by "backed"? I'm sure there are some ex-felon proponents of BTC as well.

lend000 9y ago

It was short lived, much like the battle between ETC and ETH. You can see the updated hash-rates here: https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate https://fork.lol/pow/hashrate This might equalize with BCH's fork today, which will give them a free difficulty adjustment.

jaequery 9y ago
what time is the fork happening?
smokeyj 9y ago
There really wasn't a ETC ETH battle. BCH is currently trading about 1/5 of BTC and was briefly #2 in market cap.

babaganoosh89 9y ago

The difficulty rate fluctuates depending on how many people are mining it. Sometimes BCC is more profitable to mine and everyone piles into it. Then the difficulty goes up and all the miners go back to BTC. Doesn't really mean much.

elif 9y ago
Well, it means something since the BCH fork is capable of handling wild mining fluctuations, but the BTC chain is crippled by them. It can't keep happening.

kirillseva 9y ago

that's because it's more profitable to mine BCH now before the difficulty adjustment kicks in. Didn't they recently hard fork to relax the difficulty adjustment rules so this exact situation could happen? Alternatively Bitmain has just plugged in a new batch of their ASICBoost

tfha 9y ago

This was achieved by paying miners substantially more. That payment gets pulled out of the Bitcoin Cash market cap when the miners sell their coins. This news is essentially equivalent to saying "On November 13th, Salesforce outspent Apple in cyber security. This is one of just a few days in all of history where the security spending for that day for Salesforce exceeded the security spending of Apple for that day. Apple is expected to fall into a death spiral soon."

elif 9y ago
"During which time, apple was only able to spend 5% of their normal security expenses"

throw401 9y ago

I hope this will eventually happen with bitcoingold. Bitcoin and bitcoincash should have never been allowed to be mineable with ASIC's. For now it's still Bitmain's game.

stale2002 9y ago

For those who are unaware, Bitcoin Cash is a fork of the bitcoin network (NOT an alt coin). Over the years, there have been two conflicting visions for what Bitcoin should be. The Core development team what Bitcoin to be digital gold settlement layer. A censorship resistent store of value for settling low volume, multi thousand dollar transactions, that costs hundreds of dollars per transaction. This is because the higher transaction fees are, the higher the "security" of the network is. The other, competing vision for Bitcoin, and Bitcoin Cash, is that it should be a way for every day people to make every day transactions. They believe that fees per transaction should be measured in cents, at most. This vision sacrifices some amount of security, in order to allow mass adoption. There are more complicated arguments, such as mythical "layer 2 and layer 3" solutions, called the lightning network, that could be deployed on the network, so as to help with scalability. But these solutions are perpetually 18 months away from completion. Mostly recently, the settlement layer, high fees faction "won" by stopping one of attempted upgrades to the network, and the other side responded by forking the network and going its own way. That is Bitcoin Cash.

pierrebonbon 9y ago
Bcash is just another altcoin. The sole reason for the existence of Bitcoin Cash is pump and dump + (covert) ASICBOOST by Bitmain (largest chinese ASIC manufacturer) leading to greater centralization and an unfair advantage. Please take some time to read: https://medium.com/@WhalePanda/asicboost-the-reason-why-bitmain-blocked-segwit-901fd346ee9f https://medium.com/@WhalePanda/asicboost-the-reason-why-bitm... Besides that, Lightning Network can be deployed much quicker. In fact, it already runs on testnet e.g.: https://github.com/LN-Zap/zap-desktop https://github.com/LN-Zap/zap-desktop / https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhpg_8D2FPI https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dhpg_8D2FPI So how is bitcoin core going to scale ? Take a look at this: https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/7cn5dj/so_how_is_bitcoin_going_to_scale/ https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/comments/7cn5dj/so_how_is_b... (Schnorr, RSK, Segwit, Lightning and more)
- stale2002 9y ago
  Segwit has been active for 3 months, and average blocksize is around 1.05 MB. So in 3 whole months, segwit has scaled the network by a measly 5%. All the stuff you are talking about will likely end the same way.

jettybrew 9y ago

Here's a good article on the recent situation: https://fee.org/articles/a-beginner-s-guide-to-bitcoin-chaos/ https://fee.org/articles/a-beginner-s-guide-to-bitcoin-chaos...

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kjullien 9y ago

yeah btc miners flooded with their hashrate to make profit off btc crash because of seg2x