5 ms·

I dislike articles that allude to wrong doings, but when pushed for more details on rather harsh allegations, refuse to state it. I have no way to verify it hap

by Operyl 9y ago

I dislike articles that allude to wrong doings, but when pushed for more details on rather harsh allegations, refuse to state it. I have no way to verify it happened, and I have to take someone’s possible lie as the one sided truth. EDIT: I'm referring to: "Around the same time, Eben made legal threats towards another project with ties to FSF."

jordigh 9y ago
Links are provided. For example, the SFLC trying to invalidate SFC's trademark: https://sfconservancy.org/blog/2017/nov/03/sflc-legal-action/ https://sfconservancy.org/blog/2017/nov/03/sflc-legal-action... This is bizarre to say the least.
- Operyl 9y ago
  I was referring to: "Around the same time, Eben made legal threats towards another project with ties to FSF."
  - jordigh 9y ago
    Well, that's the exact reference: Eben has sent threats to terminate SFC's trademark. Those are the legal threats.
    - Operyl 9y ago
      In the comments, the author says it wasn't disclosed, so he won't disclose it. So, I have to wonder that this is something else?
    - mjg59 9y ago
      No, this refers to another (non-public) issue.
- carussell 9y ago
  I think parent poster is referring to this paragraph in particular: > Throughout this period, Eben disparaged FSF staff and other free software community members in various semi-public settings. In doing so he harmed the credibility of many people who have devoted significant portions of their lives to aiding the free software community. At Libreplanet earlier this year he made direct threats against an attendee - this was reported as a violation of the conference's anti-harassment policy. The reason I think this is because when I opened the article there were zero comments here, and after reading the post, I clicked through back here to leave a comment much the same as the one you're responding to. A couple remarks: I'm aware who Matthew Garrett is, and I respect him and his contributions and his overall stance, in that way where when you see someone's name attached to something, it automatically kicks off good feelings. Having said that, we need a term for something like this. (One probably exists.) Wikipedia popularized "weasel words", but this is something more specialized. Something like "proxy words", where rather than tell someone the things that happened, you give them this sort of non-specific, pre-digested proxy for people to derive their judgment from. It operates on almost the same principle as strawman arguments. It may be a good proxy, or it may not be, but for good reason you should always favor reserving your judgment for the real issue when presented with a proxy, rather than accepting the proxy itself. That aside, Bruce Perens's comments in the following two LWN threads are relevant to the overall discussion: https://lwn.net/Articles/738046/ https://lwn.net/Articles/738046/ https://lwn.net/Articles/738279/ https://lwn.net/Articles/738279/
  - craigsmansion 9y ago
    > Having said that, we need a term for something like this. I think it's a form if "appeal to authority," which is not always a logical fallacy. I think it fits even if said authority will not or cannot explain certain statements. If say, a Bruce Schneier told me to avoid certain software or a certain processor, but didn't give any details, I would still heed his advice and defend that advice by appealing to his authority. In this case, of course, it depends how much trust one would place in Matthew Garret as an authority on moral judgements concerning Free Software matters.
    - carussell 9y ago

by Operyl 9y ago

jordigh 9y ago

Links are provided. For example, the SFLC trying to invalidate SFC's trademark: https://sfconservancy.org/blog/2017/nov/03/sflc-legal-action/ https://sfconservancy.org/blog/2017/nov/03/sflc-legal-action... This is bizarre to say the least.

Operyl 9y ago
I was referring to: "Around the same time, Eben made legal threats towards another project with ties to FSF."
- jordigh 9y ago
  Well, that's the exact reference: Eben has sent threats to terminate SFC's trademark. Those are the legal threats.
  - Operyl 9y ago
    In the comments, the author says it wasn't disclosed, so he won't disclose it. So, I have to wonder that this is something else?
  - mjg59 9y ago
    No, this refers to another (non-public) issue.
carussell 9y ago
I think parent poster is referring to this paragraph in particular: > Throughout this period, Eben disparaged FSF staff and other free software community members in various semi-public settings. In doing so he harmed the credibility of many people who have devoted significant portions of their lives to aiding the free software community. At Libreplanet earlier this year he made direct threats against an attendee - this was reported as a violation of the conference's anti-harassment policy. The reason I think this is because when I opened the article there were zero comments here, and after reading the post, I clicked through back here to leave a comment much the same as the one you're responding to. A couple remarks: I'm aware who Matthew Garrett is, and I respect him and his contributions and his overall stance, in that way where when you see someone's name attached to something, it automatically kicks off good feelings. Having said that, we need a term for something like this. (One probably exists.) Wikipedia popularized "weasel words", but this is something more specialized. Something like "proxy words", where rather than tell someone the things that happened, you give them this sort of non-specific, pre-digested proxy for people to derive their judgment from. It operates on almost the same principle as strawman arguments. It may be a good proxy, or it may not be, but for good reason you should always favor reserving your judgment for the real issue when presented with a proxy, rather than accepting the proxy itself. That aside, Bruce Perens's comments in the following two LWN threads are relevant to the overall discussion: https://lwn.net/Articles/738046/ https://lwn.net/Articles/738046/ https://lwn.net/Articles/738279/ https://lwn.net/Articles/738279/
- craigsmansion 9y ago
  > Having said that, we need a term for something like this. I think it's a form if "appeal to authority," which is not always a logical fallacy. I think it fits even if said authority will not or cannot explain certain statements. If say, a Bruce Schneier told me to avoid certain software or a certain processor, but didn't give any details, I would still heed his advice and defend that advice by appealing to his authority. In this case, of course, it depends how much trust one would place in Matthew Garret as an authority on moral judgements concerning Free Software matters.
  - carussell 9y ago