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This news doesn't mean it's reversible. If the parliament rejects the deal PM negotiates, UK will still leave the EU - just without said deal.

by fridek 9y ago

QAPereo 9y ago
That isn’t what I said... rather that this is already a reversible process, and this is meant to make it look as though it is not, or make it irreversible.
- lurker456 9y ago
  But it's not reversible. Triggering article 50 means leaving in 2 years or less, it has no provisions to pause or revert the process. The only way to rejoin is with the agreement of all other member states, on new and very likely less favorable terms.
  - QAPereo 9y ago
    http://www.businessinsider.com/legal-advice-brexit-can-be-reversed-strategic-error-article-50-2017-10 http://www.businessinsider.com/legal-advice-brexit-can-be-re... https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/10/brexit-date-is-not-irreversible-says-man-who-wrote-article-50-lord-kerr https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/10/brexit-date... More nuance: http://carnegieeurope.eu/strategiceurope/63955?lang=en http://carnegieeurope.eu/strategiceurope/63955?lang=en In short, the author of Article 50 disagrees.
    - Zenst 9y ago
      Shame that said author and all the MEP's since the article was made into law have overlooked displaced nationals and not one of them have thought to address that oversight in article 50 and avoid chaos. That for me highlights how fickle many MEP's are when it comes to politics as they would rather retort to rabble rabble over fixing a long-standing and glaring issue. Shame on them I say.
    - dsp1234 9y ago
      Except that the author didn't actually write that it's reversible in any way. That may have been the intent, but that's not what the actual text says, and that's not what all of the Treaty of Lisbon's signers agreed to. Indeed, the text is so clear, it's hard to argue that there is any actual room for disagreement: 3. The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period. The treaty will cease to apply upon a withdrawal agreement, or after 2 years, or after unanimous agreement to extend the period. The only action that ends up with anything reasonably resembling a "reversible" Article 50 is for the UK to somehow convince all of the EU member states to unanimously agree to an unending extension. Meaning that the UK would be in a permanent state of leaving the EU.
      - tom_mellior 9y ago
        I guess that, if the member state really wanted to reverse the process, the latter case could be turned into a sort of "state of leaving the EU until re-accession". So it could be agreed that technically, the Treaties would cease to apply at some well-defined point in time, but at the same moment they would start applying again. A fun question would be whether a re-acceding country would lose its current privileges and its opt-outs of the Euro and Schengen.

This news doesn't mean it's reversible. If the parliament rejects the deal PM negotiates, UK will still leave the EU - just without said deal.

by fridek 9y ago

This news doesn't mean it's reversible. If the parliament rejects the deal PM negotiates, UK will still leave the EU - just without said deal.

QAPereo 9y ago

That isn’t what I said... rather that this is already a reversible process, and this is meant to make it look as though it is not, or make it irreversible.

lurker456 9y ago
But it's not reversible. Triggering article 50 means leaving in 2 years or less, it has no provisions to pause or revert the process. The only way to rejoin is with the agreement of all other member states, on new and very likely less favorable terms.
- QAPereo 9y ago
  http://www.businessinsider.com/legal-advice-brexit-can-be-reversed-strategic-error-article-50-2017-10 http://www.businessinsider.com/legal-advice-brexit-can-be-re... https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/10/brexit-date-is-not-irreversible-says-man-who-wrote-article-50-lord-kerr https://www.theguardian.com/politics/2017/nov/10/brexit-date... More nuance: http://carnegieeurope.eu/strategiceurope/63955?lang=en http://carnegieeurope.eu/strategiceurope/63955?lang=en In short, the author of Article 50 disagrees.
  - Zenst 9y ago
    Shame that said author and all the MEP's since the article was made into law have overlooked displaced nationals and not one of them have thought to address that oversight in article 50 and avoid chaos. That for me highlights how fickle many MEP's are when it comes to politics as they would rather retort to rabble rabble over fixing a long-standing and glaring issue. Shame on them I say.
  - dsp1234 9y ago
    Except that the author didn't actually write that it's reversible in any way. That may have been the intent, but that's not what the actual text says, and that's not what all of the Treaty of Lisbon's signers agreed to. Indeed, the text is so clear, it's hard to argue that there is any actual room for disagreement: 3. The Treaties shall cease to apply to the State in question from the date of entry into force of the withdrawal agreement or, failing that, two years after the notification referred to in paragraph 2, unless the European Council, in agreement with the Member State concerned, unanimously decides to extend this period. The treaty will cease to apply upon a withdrawal agreement, or after 2 years, or after unanimous agreement to extend the period. The only action that ends up with anything reasonably resembling a "reversible" Article 50 is for the UK to somehow convince all of the EU member states to unanimously agree to an unending extension. Meaning that the UK would be in a permanent state of leaving the EU.
    - tom_mellior 9y ago
      I guess that, if the member state really wanted to reverse the process, the latter case could be turned into a sort of "state of leaving the EU until re-accession". So it could be agreed that technically, the Treaties would cease to apply at some well-defined point in time, but at the same moment they would start applying again. A fun question would be whether a re-acceding country would lose its current privileges and its opt-outs of the Euro and Schengen.