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As a 6'4" individual, I've already stopped flying the major airlines due to seat shrinking. Been flying JetBlue whenever it's available since their standard se

As a 6'4" individual, I've already stopped flying the major airlines due to seat shrinking. Been flying JetBlue whenever it's available since their standard seat pitch is 36". Nearly got kicked off a Delta flight once because "I refused to stop pushing my knees into the passenger in front of me." I'm sorry, but with the middle seat populated and not being allowed to put my leg in the aisle, my legs go forward - and there is not enough room to not have contact with the seat in front of me.

ciguy 9y ago
And with the new thinner seat types discussed in the article, the passenger in front feels your knees much more than they used to. I'm 6'3" and while I've never been in trouble I have gotten a lot of dirty looks from the people in front of me. Airlines need to start reserving the aisle or bulkhead seats for taller passengers or something, this isn't sustainable otherwise.
- paulsutter 9y ago
  I finally gave up and now just pay to sit up front (6’6” here)
  - regularfry 9y ago
    6'7" here. I don't fly long-haul any more.
- dmckeon 9y ago
  As a person of similar height, I would happily pay 10% more for a seat pitch that is 10% greater, just as airlines now charge for exit rows, bulkheads, etc. Make a few rows deeper, charge more for seats that pax reserve in those rows. Don't need a hot towel or free booze, thanks, just a seat that my femurs fit into, but not at 2x price of coach, darn it.
  - hkmurakami 9y ago
    I'm not even tall, but I have had flight anxiety/claustrophobia on flights before and I can only fly aisle seats. I'm often happy to pay for exit as well. What's the current markup on exit rows? 15-25%?
  - Swizec 9y ago
    > Don't need a hot towel or free booze, thanks, just a seat that my femurs fit into, but not at 2x price of coach, darn it. Isn’t this what premium economy is for? I’ve seen it for as little as 10% extra.
    - nmcfarl 9y ago
      My problem is that's it's just not available - of my 4 transcontinental flights this year, all booked 2 months in advance - only on one leg was there a premium seat for me to buy (well on 2 legs, but they canceled and rebooked one of those legs - and no premium left on the rebooked flight. ) And they simply don't sell them on Bombardier CRJs that I normally fly.
    - sitepodmatt 9y ago
      PE is usually between 80-150% of the ticket price on routes between Asia and Europe (BA, Lufthansa, EVA). However PE tickets are usually more flexible on many routes and if the company is booking flexible economy tickets (usually around +75% of cheaper saver fares) then it is only a small price more to fly PE
  - avh02 9y ago
    I like to think of this as discriminatory. I'm a human being, yes, unusually tall, but a human who has no control over their height, why should I pay more to keep blood circulating to my feet? But then the question is where does it stop, cos then little people get almost a bed while I'm getting just a seat.
    - sitepodmatt 9y ago
      Then you get obese people saying it's part of genes or they are naturally big boned so they want the wide seats. Then you get hipsters with ESAs wanting an unoccupied middle seat for their annoying dog/cat. Then the tall persons wants to sit next to their wife and kids too so they want the whole exit row for free. You dont have any control over height I guess but it's open a whole set of another problems if check-in staff start explicitly and openly profiling people. You probably find though, if travelling alone, and check-in early you can just ask for an exit room seat - only when check-in is managed by a 3rd party (check this) and the seats are already sold have I been declined, it's a request not a demand though.
- gvurrdon 9y ago
  Also 6'3", I've had some luck reserving bulkhead seats with British Airways for transatlantic flights, both for personal flights (can't afford more than the basic seat) and work (employer won't pay for more than the basic). The online reservation system has been effective, though I recall having to wait until a few days before the flight to reserve those seats. Of course, on busy flights they're not always available. I did once receive an aggressive harangue from the passenger in front on a short flight (~2 hours IIRC) about how he'd paid for his seat and had a right to recline it, but unfortunately for us both I was in the middle of a row on that occasion and had nowhere to put my knees but the back of his seat, and they touched that before he even started to recline it. This had to be resolved by the cabin crew moving me to another seat.
saddlerustle 9y ago
Every major airline gives the option of paying 10%-20% more and getting more legroom. United has Economy Plus, Delta has Comfort Plus, American Airlines has Main Cabin Extra...
- mindslight 9y ago
  Every major airline also sells their tickets based on transporting one human passenger, end of story. I'd be open to a price based on some linear combination of pitch/weight/etc. But shrinking seats so they don't fit actual people, and then upcharging for a few inches of "premium" space is downright fraudulent. It might only be 20% over their fantasy "full fare" prices, but it's a larger proportion of the actual prices most people pay.
  - mFixman 9y ago
    Regular economy airplane tickets are a lot cheaper than they used to be N years ago for any N. I fit well in a regular airline seat. Why should I pay more because a fatter or taller person wants to sit more comfortably in an airplane without paying extra for a seat in economy plus designed for that exact purpose?
    - mindslight 9y ago
      "Why should I pay more" isn't really an argument in the context of a company that is trying to extract the maximum price from every single person. Someone else's price going down will not make yours go up. But as I said, if the variation in humans is really that large, then charging a linear combination for depth/weight based on actual costs would be completely understandable. For the current state, let's take a quick look at say United [0]. A regular ticket from BOS to LAX is $139, which is in line with the general range one would expect to pay [1]. The upgrade to "Economy Plus" is $99. So for a pitch increase of 20%, the price is 70% more?! This is price discrimination based on immutable physical qualities - straight up gouging. [0] I chose what I thought would be the worst offender here [1] and has been roughly the price for well over a decade, disregarding the new bag fees
- 9y ago
Mountain_Skies 9y ago
Though not a complete solution, I wonder if it would be possible to implement a no-recline subsidy. A tall passenger could offer a subsidy, perhaps $20, on the seat in front of them in exchange for that seat being set to not recline. The passenger purchasing the no-recline seat would have to explicitly agree to accepting the restriction to get the subsidy. Given how much emphasis many fliers put on getting the least expensive ticket, I wouldn't be surprised if there would be a taker for most subsidy offers. Not sure how well the implementation would go. Would it rely on the subsidized passenger upholding their half of the deal or would it need to rely on inserting a mechanical wedge of some sort that would be a cost to the airline. Or perhaps an automated solution could be found.
- badlucklottery 9y ago
  Even unreclined it's getting so that people in the mid 6-foot range will have their knees driven into the seat in front of them if there's no room to the sides. I'm 6'6" and it's gotten to the point that the emergency row seats are getting tight (other than the one directly next to the hatch itself).
rabboRubble 9y ago
I feel for you. I'm 5'4" / 163 cm tall. In other words I'm short. Even my knees are touching the seat in front of me sometimes. Even I've had a passenger in front of me bash my knees when they reclined. How in the world anybody taller than me manages, I have no idea.

ciguy 9y ago

And with the new thinner seat types discussed in the article, the passenger in front feels your knees much more than they used to. I'm 6'3" and while I've never been in trouble I have gotten a lot of dirty looks from the people in front of me. Airlines need to start reserving the aisle or bulkhead seats for taller passengers or something, this isn't sustainable otherwise.

paulsutter 9y ago
I finally gave up and now just pay to sit up front (6’6” here)
- regularfry 9y ago
  6'7" here. I don't fly long-haul any more.
dmckeon 9y ago
As a person of similar height, I would happily pay 10% more for a seat pitch that is 10% greater, just as airlines now charge for exit rows, bulkheads, etc. Make a few rows deeper, charge more for seats that pax reserve in those rows. Don't need a hot towel or free booze, thanks, just a seat that my femurs fit into, but not at 2x price of coach, darn it.
- hkmurakami 9y ago
  I'm not even tall, but I have had flight anxiety/claustrophobia on flights before and I can only fly aisle seats. I'm often happy to pay for exit as well. What's the current markup on exit rows? 15-25%?
- Swizec 9y ago
  > Don't need a hot towel or free booze, thanks, just a seat that my femurs fit into, but not at 2x price of coach, darn it. Isn’t this what premium economy is for? I’ve seen it for as little as 10% extra.
  - nmcfarl 9y ago
    My problem is that's it's just not available - of my 4 transcontinental flights this year, all booked 2 months in advance - only on one leg was there a premium seat for me to buy (well on 2 legs, but they canceled and rebooked one of those legs - and no premium left on the rebooked flight. ) And they simply don't sell them on Bombardier CRJs that I normally fly.
  - sitepodmatt 9y ago
    PE is usually between 80-150% of the ticket price on routes between Asia and Europe (BA, Lufthansa, EVA). However PE tickets are usually more flexible on many routes and if the company is booking flexible economy tickets (usually around +75% of cheaper saver fares) then it is only a small price more to fly PE
- avh02 9y ago
  I like to think of this as discriminatory. I'm a human being, yes, unusually tall, but a human who has no control over their height, why should I pay more to keep blood circulating to my feet? But then the question is where does it stop, cos then little people get almost a bed while I'm getting just a seat.
  - sitepodmatt 9y ago
    Then you get obese people saying it's part of genes or they are naturally big boned so they want the wide seats. Then you get hipsters with ESAs wanting an unoccupied middle seat for their annoying dog/cat. Then the tall persons wants to sit next to their wife and kids too so they want the whole exit row for free. You dont have any control over height I guess but it's open a whole set of another problems if check-in staff start explicitly and openly profiling people. You probably find though, if travelling alone, and check-in early you can just ask for an exit room seat - only when check-in is managed by a 3rd party (check this) and the seats are already sold have I been declined, it's a request not a demand though.
gvurrdon 9y ago
Also 6'3", I've had some luck reserving bulkhead seats with British Airways for transatlantic flights, both for personal flights (can't afford more than the basic seat) and work (employer won't pay for more than the basic). The online reservation system has been effective, though I recall having to wait until a few days before the flight to reserve those seats. Of course, on busy flights they're not always available. I did once receive an aggressive harangue from the passenger in front on a short flight (~2 hours IIRC) about how he'd paid for his seat and had a right to recline it, but unfortunately for us both I was in the middle of a row on that occasion and had nowhere to put my knees but the back of his seat, and they touched that before he even started to recline it. This had to be resolved by the cabin crew moving me to another seat.

saddlerustle 9y ago

Every major airline gives the option of paying 10%-20% more and getting more legroom. United has Economy Plus, Delta has Comfort Plus, American Airlines has Main Cabin Extra...

mindslight 9y ago
Every major airline also sells their tickets based on transporting one human passenger, end of story. I'd be open to a price based on some linear combination of pitch/weight/etc. But shrinking seats so they don't fit actual people, and then upcharging for a few inches of "premium" space is downright fraudulent. It might only be 20% over their fantasy "full fare" prices, but it's a larger proportion of the actual prices most people pay.
- mFixman 9y ago
  Regular economy airplane tickets are a lot cheaper than they used to be N years ago for any N. I fit well in a regular airline seat. Why should I pay more because a fatter or taller person wants to sit more comfortably in an airplane without paying extra for a seat in economy plus designed for that exact purpose?
  - mindslight 9y ago
    "Why should I pay more" isn't really an argument in the context of a company that is trying to extract the maximum price from every single person. Someone else's price going down will not make yours go up. But as I said, if the variation in humans is really that large, then charging a linear combination for depth/weight based on actual costs would be completely understandable. For the current state, let's take a quick look at say United [0]. A regular ticket from BOS to LAX is $139, which is in line with the general range one would expect to pay [1]. The upgrade to "Economy Plus" is $99. So for a pitch increase of 20%, the price is 70% more?! This is price discrimination based on immutable physical qualities - straight up gouging. [0] I chose what I thought would be the worst offender here [1] and has been roughly the price for well over a decade, disregarding the new bag fees
9y ago

Mountain_Skies 9y ago

Though not a complete solution, I wonder if it would be possible to implement a no-recline subsidy. A tall passenger could offer a subsidy, perhaps $20, on the seat in front of them in exchange for that seat being set to not recline. The passenger purchasing the no-recline seat would have to explicitly agree to accepting the restriction to get the subsidy. Given how much emphasis many fliers put on getting the least expensive ticket, I wouldn't be surprised if there would be a taker for most subsidy offers. Not sure how well the implementation would go. Would it rely on the subsidized passenger upholding their half of the deal or would it need to rely on inserting a mechanical wedge of some sort that would be a cost to the airline. Or perhaps an automated solution could be found.

badlucklottery 9y ago
Even unreclined it's getting so that people in the mid 6-foot range will have their knees driven into the seat in front of them if there's no room to the sides. I'm 6'6" and it's gotten to the point that the emergency row seats are getting tight (other than the one directly next to the hatch itself).

rabboRubble 9y ago

I feel for you. I'm 5'4" / 163 cm tall. In other words I'm short. Even my knees are touching the seat in front of me sometimes. Even I've had a passenger in front of me bash my knees when they reclined. How in the world anybody taller than me manages, I have no idea.