4 ms·
I think the problem is once you get into coding it yourself, docs/tutorials/stackoverflow make you aware of all sorts of things like dev tools (IDEs, editors, p
by MechanicalTwerk 9y ago
I think the problem is once you get into coding it yourself, docs/tutorials/stackoverflow make you aware of all sorts of things like dev tools (IDEs, editors, package managers, VCS, VMs, containers, the list is goes on...) or security concepts (csrf tokens, ssl, secrets management, again the list goes on...) and as a non-tehnical person you start to get really uncomfortable and overwhelmed because you don't know what all this stuff is and you don't know which things are necessary to learn and which are "nice to haves" to build something simple. So you either give up or you try to learn as much as you can about these things. But learning about these things is a slippery slope because before you know it months (or even years) have gone by and you're no closer to shipping that simple idea you had. Sure, you've learned a ton! You may have even learned enough to get a junior dev role somewhere which is great! But you never finished that original thing you were working on which IMO we need more of. We need less people getting burnt out in dev roles after 5 years because that's not really where their heart lied in the first place and we need more people finishing the projects that got them into coding. Not saying Bubble or any of the other visual programming tools are perfect but I think saying people should just learn Python and Django and code it themselves ignores how complicated that path actually is and how few people actually go down that path and get their ideas out into the world. Anvil.works was on here recently and I think that strikes a nice balance. It's not perfect either but I guess I'm just saying I think it's great people are working on stuff like this. And, as mentioned in another comment, this thing has a $1.2M run rate. Clearly it's useful to someone.
- mitchtbaum 9y agohttp://wiki.c2.com/?IntelligentDefaults http://wiki.c2.com/?IntelligentDefaults http://wiki.c2.com/?SecureByDefault http://wiki.c2.com/?SecureByDefault http://wiki.c2.com/?DefaultObject http://wiki.c2.com/?DefaultObject http://wiki.c2.com/?DefaultValue http://wiki.c2.com/?DefaultValue http://wiki.c2.com/?NullObject http://wiki.c2.com/?NullObject http://wiki.c2.com/?NullValue http://wiki.c2.com/?NullValue
- MechanicalTwerk 9y agoAre you saying sane and secure defaults in Django or any other web framework should be enough for a beginner to not have to to worry about this stuff? See another issue for beginners trying to figure it out is they have to deal with people online who post 6 links with no explanation as if it's SOOOO obvious.
- riquito 9y agoThis is not a tutorial and he/she is not answering to a beginner. A description would have helped nonetheless
- mitchtbaum 9y agoThanks. MechanicalTwerk, I meant this is how to make that slope less slippery and steep. They're software design patterns -- going with principles and paradigms, like https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Structured_programming https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Structured_programming
- MechanicalTwerk 9y agoAgreed that design patterns and just thoughtful design in general can help create frameworks that are easy to get up and running. I guess what I was getting at is that a non-coder could probably stay completely in the browser, maybe even completely on the bubble.is site (bouncing back and forth between the docs and the editor) and have a clear path to launching an app that they can feel comfortable knowing is secure and will probably perform well enough. With Python and Django, they'd have to cobble more things together and the risk that they end up going down some rabbit hole that doesn't quite have to do with their initial goal is greater.
- mitchtbaum 9y ago> stay completely in the browser [focusing on] ...their initial goal I believe this is worthwhile long range target that we can build up to on solid foundation, such as component oriented software. As the pieces come together, the harder fought wins that use and prove its foundation early on will pay off greater, later.
- xstartup 9y agoDo you know any other such website? I found these explanations useful.