4 ms·

Except the driver-less shuttle didn't take any evasive action, the way a human would have. Did it even honk the horn? Clearly this company's tech isn't up to p

by eloff 9y ago

Except the driver-less shuttle didn't take any evasive action, the way a human would have. Did it even honk the horn? Clearly this company's tech isn't up to par.

mikeash 9y ago
Plenty of humans freeze up or react slowly when confronted with something like this.
- sundaeofshock 9y ago
  That’s true, but theoit h for autonomous cars is that don’t freeze and they don’t react slowly. They are better drivers then humans.
tdfx 9y ago
Yeah I watch people freeze and let people back into them all the time in parking lots while they furiously honk. I think you may be overestimating the abilities of the average human driver.
- adriand 9y ago
  I did this. My neighbour backed into me. And I honked before he hit me but otherwise did nothing. To an observer it may have seemed ridiculous but the reason is simple: I assumed he could see me and it wasn’t until it was too late that I realized he wasn’t paying attention and was going to hit me. By then I had no time to put the car in reverse and move, only to honk.
- bdamm 9y ago
  Yep; I'm guilty. When I was a teenager, the first time someone backed into me, I was so surprised I got confused about what to do and consequently did nothing. And by the time I found the horn button it was too late. I was so surprised that I just sat on the horn for about 5 seconds even though it was all over at that point. So, now the makers of this vehicle can code some better evasion technique and consequently all future versions will benefit, very much unlike my children, who have a high probability of reacting just like me the first time it happens to them. (Sure, maybe I will teach them, but then again maybe not.)
  - chmod775 9y ago
    I'm curious: Did you do some kind of sports back then? Soccer, basketball etc.? I wonder if sports or videogames may teach people to react in stressful situations instead of freezing, since both of those require you to apply problem solving in split second decisions. Sorry for being off topic.
    - bdamm 9y ago
      I rode bicycles a lot. Certainly when riding bicycles one must have split second and correctly made decisions. My driver training involved simulated head on collisions where an instructor would get in another car and drive at me head on to train my response. So I had reasonable training. It was just that in a parking lot I never expected someone to just throw it in reverse and back into me without looking where they were going. It simply had never occurred to me that it could happen. So when it did happen I was so busy thinking about what I could do that I didn't do any of the things I could do (honk, or put it in reverse and back out of the way.) Since then I've avoided dozens of accidents that were new and unique in their own way, but also I've been through a few situations and have now developed good instincts about what the options are in a given situation. It's not unusual, by the way. Pilots train emergency scenarios for just this reason.
rifung 9y ago
> Did it even honk the horn? I don't disagree with what you're saying but 3/3 times I have honked my horn as someone was backing into me and they still hit me. Another time I was a passenger when it happened.
- Piskvorrr 9y ago
  Out of all the hundreds of times I have warned someone "look out you doofus, you're about to hit me!" by honking the horn, I've had about two low-speed bruises. Most of the time a collision was averted - I drive in city traffic, mostly. #anecdata
dragonwriter 9y ago
> Except the driver-less shuttle didn't take any evasive action, the way a human would have. Stopping was an evasive action, and since the result was a graze, it may have been moderately successful. While the people on the bus seem (from the article) to think there was time for more action, the perception of time under the adrenaline rush of an imminent collision may be misleading.
- AnimalMuppet 9y ago
  But a human facing an imminent collision, under the adrenaline rush, can often take more evasive action than there seems to be time for (if they don't freeze).
- phil21 9y ago
  > the perception of time under the adrenaline rush of an imminent collision may be misleading. This may be one of the more ridiculous excuses I've seen for self driving vehicle "screwups". Is the argument actually computers can't take action instantly compared to a human? If so, then self driving cars may as well not exist. It's well within a computer's capability to take evasive action for an accident like this far before a human driver - assuming sufficient sensor input. This is exactly the reason I want to see self driving tech rapidly accelerate - a car that has it's situational awareness 100% at all times, and thus can react instantly in a safe manner to any situation. I understand the software is not up to that point yet - and your response is exactly what I fear the most. I see endless DoS attacks against self driving cars once they get even a remotely substantial percentage of the market. If all programming reverts to "failsafe stop when things may be remotely potentially unsafe" we are going to see traffic problems of a proportion we have never experienced.
  - thethirdone 9y ago
    >> the perception of time under the adrenaline rush of an imminent collision may be misleading. >This may be one of the more ridiculous excuses I've seen for self driving vehicle "screwups". >Is the argument actually computers can't take action instantly compared to a human? If so, then self driving cars may as well not exist. No, I don't think that's what the parent comment meant. It means that the people who said that it didn't take proper action (that were there) may have been mistaken in thinking there was more time to act than there was.

by eloff 9y ago

Except the driver-less shuttle didn't take any evasive action, the way a human would have. Did it even honk the horn? Clearly this company's tech isn't up to par.

mikeash 9y ago

Plenty of humans freeze up or react slowly when confronted with something like this.

sundaeofshock 9y ago
That’s true, but theoit h for autonomous cars is that don’t freeze and they don’t react slowly. They are better drivers then humans.

tdfx 9y ago

Yeah I watch people freeze and let people back into them all the time in parking lots while they furiously honk. I think you may be overestimating the abilities of the average human driver.

adriand 9y ago
I did this. My neighbour backed into me. And I honked before he hit me but otherwise did nothing. To an observer it may have seemed ridiculous but the reason is simple: I assumed he could see me and it wasn’t until it was too late that I realized he wasn’t paying attention and was going to hit me. By then I had no time to put the car in reverse and move, only to honk.
bdamm 9y ago
Yep; I'm guilty. When I was a teenager, the first time someone backed into me, I was so surprised I got confused about what to do and consequently did nothing. And by the time I found the horn button it was too late. I was so surprised that I just sat on the horn for about 5 seconds even though it was all over at that point. So, now the makers of this vehicle can code some better evasion technique and consequently all future versions will benefit, very much unlike my children, who have a high probability of reacting just like me the first time it happens to them. (Sure, maybe I will teach them, but then again maybe not.)
- chmod775 9y ago
  I'm curious: Did you do some kind of sports back then? Soccer, basketball etc.? I wonder if sports or videogames may teach people to react in stressful situations instead of freezing, since both of those require you to apply problem solving in split second decisions. Sorry for being off topic.
  - bdamm 9y ago
    I rode bicycles a lot. Certainly when riding bicycles one must have split second and correctly made decisions. My driver training involved simulated head on collisions where an instructor would get in another car and drive at me head on to train my response. So I had reasonable training. It was just that in a parking lot I never expected someone to just throw it in reverse and back into me without looking where they were going. It simply had never occurred to me that it could happen. So when it did happen I was so busy thinking about what I could do that I didn't do any of the things I could do (honk, or put it in reverse and back out of the way.) Since then I've avoided dozens of accidents that were new and unique in their own way, but also I've been through a few situations and have now developed good instincts about what the options are in a given situation. It's not unusual, by the way. Pilots train emergency scenarios for just this reason.

rifung 9y ago

> Did it even honk the horn? I don't disagree with what you're saying but 3/3 times I have honked my horn as someone was backing into me and they still hit me. Another time I was a passenger when it happened.

Piskvorrr 9y ago
Out of all the hundreds of times I have warned someone "look out you doofus, you're about to hit me!" by honking the horn, I've had about two low-speed bruises. Most of the time a collision was averted - I drive in city traffic, mostly. #anecdata

dragonwriter 9y ago

> Except the driver-less shuttle didn't take any evasive action, the way a human would have. Stopping was an evasive action, and since the result was a graze, it may have been moderately successful. While the people on the bus seem (from the article) to think there was time for more action, the perception of time under the adrenaline rush of an imminent collision may be misleading.

AnimalMuppet 9y ago
But a human facing an imminent collision, under the adrenaline rush, can often take more evasive action than there seems to be time for (if they don't freeze).
phil21 9y ago
> the perception of time under the adrenaline rush of an imminent collision may be misleading. This may be one of the more ridiculous excuses I've seen for self driving vehicle "screwups". Is the argument actually computers can't take action instantly compared to a human? If so, then self driving cars may as well not exist. It's well within a computer's capability to take evasive action for an accident like this far before a human driver - assuming sufficient sensor input. This is exactly the reason I want to see self driving tech rapidly accelerate - a car that has it's situational awareness 100% at all times, and thus can react instantly in a safe manner to any situation. I understand the software is not up to that point yet - and your response is exactly what I fear the most. I see endless DoS attacks against self driving cars once they get even a remotely substantial percentage of the market. If all programming reverts to "failsafe stop when things may be remotely potentially unsafe" we are going to see traffic problems of a proportion we have never experienced.
- thethirdone 9y ago
  >> the perception of time under the adrenaline rush of an imminent collision may be misleading. >This may be one of the more ridiculous excuses I've seen for self driving vehicle "screwups". >Is the argument actually computers can't take action instantly compared to a human? If so, then self driving cars may as well not exist. No, I don't think that's what the parent comment meant. It means that the people who said that it didn't take proper action (that were there) may have been mistaken in thinking there was more time to act than there was.