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I don't get the US stance on opioids. In Germany they are heavily regulated and can't be obtained without special prescription giving them an rather exclusive a

I don't get the US stance on opioids. In Germany they are heavily regulated and can't be obtained without special prescription giving them an rather exclusive aura. No German doctor would prescribe them for headaches and people only really get them after serious surgery for a really short term. Advil (Ibuprofen) and Aspirin (ASS) are far more common here and used for pain management at a far broader extent than in the US. And frankly so, Germany doesn't have an opioid problem. That said, I think Bayer (manufacturer of Aspirin) being a German company could have something to do with that, on the other hand seeing the immense money spent on lobbying by Opioid companies in the US really says a lot. IIRC Purdue even paid university professors to downplay risks of Oxy in front of their students so they would get a biased view on them already.

jedmeyers 9y ago
Bayer is the original manufacturer and trademark holder for Heroin, so I imagine they could have entered the opioid game if they wanted to. However, they might still remember the 100 years old lesson of what comes from marketing opioids to the general population.
strictnein 9y ago
Your view looking into the US may be a little flawed, to be honest. Opioids are also regulated in the US. No one gets them for headaches. Doctors recommend Tylenol and Advil for most aches and pain. The times when my wife and I have received Opioids: broken ankles, back injuries from weight lifting, and after c-sections. I didn't receive them when I broke my collarbones (I've broken both, on separate occasions). > I think Bayer (manufacturer of Aspirin) being a German company... Tylenol is produced by a huge American company: Johnson and Johnson. Advil is produced by another huge American company: Pfizer.
- lovich 9y ago
  I get fiorecet for migraines after the doctor tried me out on a few other preventative medications which either didn't work or had side effects like making me as sleepy as taking two Benadryl. There as needed and I can go months between refilling the script sometimes but it's still for headaches
  - strictnein 9y ago
    I mean, I get migraines too, and they're completely debilitating, but I would personally just classifiy them as something very different than a headache. Undersells just how horrible they can be.
    - lovich 9y ago
      Yea, wasnt sure if the OP was including them or not. Some people do when they say "headaches". If I dont take any medication before getting a migraine and it goes all the way I am incapable of even moving
tunichtgut 9y ago
"And frankly so, Germany doesn't have an opioid problem." You are very uninformed obviously. As far as i know for my town, Paderborn (NRW), we have about 1.000 people receiving opioid replacement drugs under government supervision (~90.000 city population).
- dna_polymerase 9y ago
  While opioid abuse is rising, yes even in Germany, situations are not really comparable. In the US 20.5 Million people have a substance abuse disorder. Of which 2M have a problem involving prescription pain relievers, and roughly 600k people are addicted to Heroin. [0] For Germany data on this matter is generally less available, but reports range from 1.5M to 1.9M users of prescription drugs for Germany, that number includes sleep-aids and Benzos as well though. Zolpidem based drugs actually make up for 3/4 of German prescription drug abuse. [1] The official drug report mentions 160k high-risk opioid users and 77k in substitution programmes. [2] (That's actually far far less than the 1/90 rate you report for your city. Talking about uninformed...) Also for comparison of the problem, let's look at the death rates in the US [3] and Germany [2]: 33k vs 1.2k now in relation to the population (age 15-64): US: 0.000160 % Germany: 0.0000226415 % US death rate is 7 times higher than the German, while population is only 4 times bigger. That said, a look at the opioid users in Germany (160k) and US (2M+600k) is way clearer. We are talking about 16 times the abuse rate in the US compared to Germany. So yeah, Germany doesn't have an opioid problem, compared to the US. So while Germany has heroin addicts, the US actually has a drug addict training program running. In the US there are 290M opioid prescriptions per year. [4] And while Germany doesn't have those outstanding numbers, Big Pharma is pushing for change in Germany [5 (German)] [0]: https://www.asam.org/docs/default-source/advocacy/opioid-addiction-disease-facts-figures.pdf https://www.asam.org/docs/default-source/advocacy/opioid-add... [1]: http://www.dw.com/en/medication-abuse-a-growing-concern-in-germany/a-38389406 http://www.dw.com/en/medication-abuse-a-growing-concern-in-g... [2]: http://www.emcdda.europa.eu/system/files/publications/4528/TD0416906ENN.pdf http://www.emcdda.europa.eu/system/files/publications/4528/T... [3]: https://www.cdc.gov/drugoverdose/index.html https://www.cdc.gov/drugoverdose/index.html [4]: https://addiction.surgeongeneral.gov/surgeon-generals-report.pdf https://addiction.surgeongeneral.gov/surgeon-generals-report... [5]: http://www.spiegel.de/gesundheit/diagnose/oxycodon-fentanyl-oder-codein-aerzte-verschreiben-immer-mehr-opioide-a-1155711.html http://www.spiegel.de/gesundheit/diagnose/oxycodon-fentanyl-...

jedmeyers 9y ago

Bayer is the original manufacturer and trademark holder for Heroin, so I imagine they could have entered the opioid game if they wanted to. However, they might still remember the 100 years old lesson of what comes from marketing opioids to the general population.

strictnein 9y ago

Your view looking into the US may be a little flawed, to be honest. Opioids are also regulated in the US. No one gets them for headaches. Doctors recommend Tylenol and Advil for most aches and pain. The times when my wife and I have received Opioids: broken ankles, back injuries from weight lifting, and after c-sections. I didn't receive them when I broke my collarbones (I've broken both, on separate occasions). > I think Bayer (manufacturer of Aspirin) being a German company... Tylenol is produced by a huge American company: Johnson and Johnson. Advil is produced by another huge American company: Pfizer.

lovich 9y ago
I get fiorecet for migraines after the doctor tried me out on a few other preventative medications which either didn't work or had side effects like making me as sleepy as taking two Benadryl. There as needed and I can go months between refilling the script sometimes but it's still for headaches
- strictnein 9y ago
  I mean, I get migraines too, and they're completely debilitating, but I would personally just classifiy them as something very different than a headache. Undersells just how horrible they can be.
  - lovich 9y ago
    Yea, wasnt sure if the OP was including them or not. Some people do when they say "headaches". If I dont take any medication before getting a migraine and it goes all the way I am incapable of even moving

tunichtgut 9y ago

"And frankly so, Germany doesn't have an opioid problem." You are very uninformed obviously. As far as i know for my town, Paderborn (NRW), we have about 1.000 people receiving opioid replacement drugs under government supervision (~90.000 city population).

dna_polymerase 9y ago
While opioid abuse is rising, yes even in Germany, situations are not really comparable. In the US 20.5 Million people have a substance abuse disorder. Of which 2M have a problem involving prescription pain relievers, and roughly 600k people are addicted to Heroin. [0] For Germany data on this matter is generally less available, but reports range from 1.5M to 1.9M users of prescription drugs for Germany, that number includes sleep-aids and Benzos as well though. Zolpidem based drugs actually make up for 3/4 of German prescription drug abuse. [1] The official drug report mentions 160k high-risk opioid users and 77k in substitution programmes. [2] (That's actually far far less than the 1/90 rate you report for your city. Talking about uninformed...) Also for comparison of the problem, let's look at the death rates in the US [3] and Germany [2]: 33k vs 1.2k now in relation to the population (age 15-64): US: 0.000160 % Germany: 0.0000226415 % US death rate is 7 times higher than the German, while population is only 4 times bigger. That said, a look at the opioid users in Germany (160k) and US (2M+600k) is way clearer. We are talking about 16 times the abuse rate in the US compared to Germany. So yeah, Germany doesn't have an opioid problem, compared to the US. So while Germany has heroin addicts, the US actually has a drug addict training program running. In the US there are 290M opioid prescriptions per year. [4] And while Germany doesn't have those outstanding numbers, Big Pharma is pushing for change in Germany [5 (German)] [0]: https://www.asam.org/docs/default-source/advocacy/opioid-addiction-disease-facts-figures.pdf https://www.asam.org/docs/default-source/advocacy/opioid-add... [1]: http://www.dw.com/en/medication-abuse-a-growing-concern-in-germany/a-38389406 http://www.dw.com/en/medication-abuse-a-growing-concern-in-g... [2]: http://www.emcdda.europa.eu/system/files/publications/4528/TD0416906ENN.pdf http://www.emcdda.europa.eu/system/files/publications/4528/T... [3]: https://www.cdc.gov/drugoverdose/index.html https://www.cdc.gov/drugoverdose/index.html [4]: https://addiction.surgeongeneral.gov/surgeon-generals-report.pdf https://addiction.surgeongeneral.gov/surgeon-generals-report... [5]: http://www.spiegel.de/gesundheit/diagnose/oxycodon-fentanyl-oder-codein-aerzte-verschreiben-immer-mehr-opioide-a-1155711.html http://www.spiegel.de/gesundheit/diagnose/oxycodon-fentanyl-...