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What do you mean about HK being hard if you're not a native, and not being able to go out in shorts and sandals, etc? Could you outline the steps necessary to

What do you mean about HK being hard if you're not a native, and not being able to go out in shorts and sandals, etc? Could you outline the steps necessary to start a business in Hong Kong? IIRC there was a requirement for a local "secretary", which sounded confusing.

mahmud 16y ago
Hong Kong culture is absolutely merciless about people living on a low budget and running business on the cheap. Specially for foreigners. There, conspicuous spending is a way of life and you're expected to throw cash at everything. The way Honkies and expats make their living is to constantly rub other people's backs, host parties, exchange gifts and keep up appearances. If you're not in >$1000 suit and not seen in exclusive hangouts or driving a black European import, you're a nobody. You have very few options for living (there are no suburbs or neighboring towns.) You either hangout with the tourists and transients merchants in the southern tip of Kowloon, and get nickled and dimed by merchants. Or you can suit up and live somewhere "decent", HK Island side and live the spender life I described above. Or you can live in the fringes of HK, in the New Territories, Lantau Island or some other no-man's land. The first thing anybody will ask you is "where do you live". The location of your office is of prime importance. You will see most HK companies have photos of their office buildings, that's because there are a ton of paper businesses there and people go overboard to establish their solvency, if not their legitimacy. Everyone has a business card too. The business registration requirement for HK is essentially $1k. Their laws are so flexible as to be an informality. If you have the money, Hong Kong will accommodate all your wishes. You just pay any accountant or lawyer anywhere in Tsim Tsa Tsui and you get a folder the same day. Then you take $5k to HSBC and open a business account. You're done. You ring up your favorite credit-card processor and get an ACH.
- gizmomagico 16y ago
  Thanks for the explanation! It sounds like it's a crazy place. So all you need is $1k and you're in business? But what would I be paying an accountant or lawyer for - handling the registration? Couldn't I just do that myself, and/or did the "secretary" requirement not exist after all? I suppose $5k is the bank's only requirement for starting a business account then? > If you have the money, Hong Kong will accommodate all your wishes. Would "having the money" mean being rich, or just being able to pay whatever fees you come across?
- lzw 16y ago
  I love the response. See, I don't care about "keeping up appearances" or anyone thinking that I'm "a nobody"-- in hong kong. I'm not going to be trying to persuade anyone in hong kong of anything, other than technical points at meetups, maybe. But $6k to have a business and bank account and be set up, and it sounds like you can do it in a day, that is valuable. That is damn good compared to many parts of the world, especially if speed is important.
  - chpapa 16y ago
    I'm a native in Hong Kong and have been doing my first startup (PandaForm) here, hope these information are helpful: 1. It is true that you can have only HKD 5k (~USD 650) to start a business up here. Something like HKD 5k (~ USD 650) to hire someone to help you do the company / business registration so you don't have to worry about. Every year you need to pay a small fee for the registration again and pay another HKD 5k for an certified accountant to do your audit report. That's all. 2. Frankly the government is not very "pro-technology" but there are still different programs from funding (such as SERAP) to cheap and nice office (Cyberport and Science Park). Plus you enjoy a nice but very cheap Internet and wireless network here in HK. 3. Lack of funding is probably the biggest problem for startups in Hong Kong, but since you've mentioned it is not that important… Otherwise a lot of local startup moved to ShenZhen or Guangzhou solely for better funding opportunities. 4. Startup Culture is becoming better here. Just take a look at Startups Saturday 2010 (a event for startups this Sat.) here: http://startupshk.com/sus2010/ http://startupshk.com/sus2010/ There are about 4 - 5 different technology user-groups / web events every months.. 5. Other factual information to share: 5.1. HKD have a linked exchange rate with USD for HKD7.75 - 7.85 : $1 5.2. Rent is about HKD 10k - 16k per month for a reasonable nice office for 5 man team. 5.3. Young programmer salary are about HKD15k - 20k per month
  - quant18 16y ago
    The problem in Hong Kong is that business setup is not equivalent to residency permission. The Companies Registry will let you fill out your lawyer's office or even your friend's uncle's plumber's address on your business registration certificate. The Immigration Department, on the other hand, will not just automatically give you a visa to come live here and run your business. They are not mysterious and arbitrary like in the U.S. --- but they are quite strict when it comes to new businesses. They want you to have a nice office, local employees, long years of work experience, brand-name degrees, and a formal business plan with revenue projections. See this link for a lot more details: http://www.emigra.com.hk/hongkong/page76.php http://www.emigra.com.hk/hongkong/page76.php On the other hand, if you can qualify for the Quality Migrant Admission Scheme, you have a year before you need to show them any of the above. But they only let in one batch a year, I think in June. http://www.immd.gov.hk/ehtml/QMAS.htm http://www.immd.gov.hk/ehtml/QMAS.htm http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quality_Migrant_Admission_Scheme http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quality_Migrant_Admission_Schem... As for the business climate: if you have a physical product, HK is still the world's greatest gateway to China. If you're developing webapps, the broadband is good here and there's enough coders floating around. Once you're profitable, the immigration department suddenly becomes much nicer to you and will let you sponsor whatever staff you need. Taxes are low and simple (BUT, if you're a US citizen, they're not, because the IRS treats any American who owns a company overseas as a tax evader and demands insane documentation. You will have to understand at minimum the IRS forms 5471 and 8832, or more likely hire a lawyer to understand it for you). And, a final warning: if you're trying to do anything pertaining to real estate or telecoms (AirBnB, Renthop, etc.), bring a pair of brass balls and a copy of Alice Poon's "Land and the ruling class in Hong Kong", because you're up against monopolists who own the government and all the infrastructure and will use them to crush you: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1493290 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1493290

mahmud 16y ago

Hong Kong culture is absolutely merciless about people living on a low budget and running business on the cheap. Specially for foreigners. There, conspicuous spending is a way of life and you're expected to throw cash at everything. The way Honkies and expats make their living is to constantly rub other people's backs, host parties, exchange gifts and keep up appearances. If you're not in >$1000 suit and not seen in exclusive hangouts or driving a black European import, you're a nobody. You have very few options for living (there are no suburbs or neighboring towns.) You either hangout with the tourists and transients merchants in the southern tip of Kowloon, and get nickled and dimed by merchants. Or you can suit up and live somewhere "decent", HK Island side and live the spender life I described above. Or you can live in the fringes of HK, in the New Territories, Lantau Island or some other no-man's land. The first thing anybody will ask you is "where do you live". The location of your office is of prime importance. You will see most HK companies have photos of their office buildings, that's because there are a ton of paper businesses there and people go overboard to establish their solvency, if not their legitimacy. Everyone has a business card too. The business registration requirement for HK is essentially $1k. Their laws are so flexible as to be an informality. If you have the money, Hong Kong will accommodate all your wishes. You just pay any accountant or lawyer anywhere in Tsim Tsa Tsui and you get a folder the same day. Then you take $5k to HSBC and open a business account. You're done. You ring up your favorite credit-card processor and get an ACH.

gizmomagico 16y ago
Thanks for the explanation! It sounds like it's a crazy place. So all you need is $1k and you're in business? But what would I be paying an accountant or lawyer for - handling the registration? Couldn't I just do that myself, and/or did the "secretary" requirement not exist after all? I suppose $5k is the bank's only requirement for starting a business account then? > If you have the money, Hong Kong will accommodate all your wishes. Would "having the money" mean being rich, or just being able to pay whatever fees you come across?
lzw 16y ago
I love the response. See, I don't care about "keeping up appearances" or anyone thinking that I'm "a nobody"-- in hong kong. I'm not going to be trying to persuade anyone in hong kong of anything, other than technical points at meetups, maybe. But $6k to have a business and bank account and be set up, and it sounds like you can do it in a day, that is valuable. That is damn good compared to many parts of the world, especially if speed is important.
- chpapa 16y ago
  I'm a native in Hong Kong and have been doing my first startup (PandaForm) here, hope these information are helpful: 1. It is true that you can have only HKD 5k (~USD 650) to start a business up here. Something like HKD 5k (~ USD 650) to hire someone to help you do the company / business registration so you don't have to worry about. Every year you need to pay a small fee for the registration again and pay another HKD 5k for an certified accountant to do your audit report. That's all. 2. Frankly the government is not very "pro-technology" but there are still different programs from funding (such as SERAP) to cheap and nice office (Cyberport and Science Park). Plus you enjoy a nice but very cheap Internet and wireless network here in HK. 3. Lack of funding is probably the biggest problem for startups in Hong Kong, but since you've mentioned it is not that important… Otherwise a lot of local startup moved to ShenZhen or Guangzhou solely for better funding opportunities. 4. Startup Culture is becoming better here. Just take a look at Startups Saturday 2010 (a event for startups this Sat.) here: http://startupshk.com/sus2010/ http://startupshk.com/sus2010/ There are about 4 - 5 different technology user-groups / web events every months.. 5. Other factual information to share: 5.1. HKD have a linked exchange rate with USD for HKD7.75 - 7.85 : $1 5.2. Rent is about HKD 10k - 16k per month for a reasonable nice office for 5 man team. 5.3. Young programmer salary are about HKD15k - 20k per month
- quant18 16y ago
  The problem in Hong Kong is that business setup is not equivalent to residency permission. The Companies Registry will let you fill out your lawyer's office or even your friend's uncle's plumber's address on your business registration certificate. The Immigration Department, on the other hand, will not just automatically give you a visa to come live here and run your business. They are not mysterious and arbitrary like in the U.S. --- but they are quite strict when it comes to new businesses. They want you to have a nice office, local employees, long years of work experience, brand-name degrees, and a formal business plan with revenue projections. See this link for a lot more details: http://www.emigra.com.hk/hongkong/page76.php http://www.emigra.com.hk/hongkong/page76.php On the other hand, if you can qualify for the Quality Migrant Admission Scheme, you have a year before you need to show them any of the above. But they only let in one batch a year, I think in June. http://www.immd.gov.hk/ehtml/QMAS.htm http://www.immd.gov.hk/ehtml/QMAS.htm http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quality_Migrant_Admission_Scheme http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quality_Migrant_Admission_Schem... As for the business climate: if you have a physical product, HK is still the world's greatest gateway to China. If you're developing webapps, the broadband is good here and there's enough coders floating around. Once you're profitable, the immigration department suddenly becomes much nicer to you and will let you sponsor whatever staff you need. Taxes are low and simple (BUT, if you're a US citizen, they're not, because the IRS treats any American who owns a company overseas as a tax evader and demands insane documentation. You will have to understand at minimum the IRS forms 5471 and 8832, or more likely hire a lawyer to understand it for you). And, a final warning: if you're trying to do anything pertaining to real estate or telecoms (AirBnB, Renthop, etc.), bring a pair of brass balls and a copy of Alice Poon's "Land and the ruling class in Hong Kong", because you're up against monopolists who own the government and all the infrastructure and will use them to crush you: http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1493290 http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=1493290