3 ms·

Let’s be real — he was probably asked to leave.

by dogruck 9y ago

r00fus 9y ago
Real question is why.
- ChuckMcM 9y ago
  The implication being of course that as the head of the division responsible for making batteries, he took the fall for not enough batteries available to sell product. What is interesting about that implication though is that while to me and others it seems "clearly" implied, there isn't any one thing you would point to that says it is what it is. I have seen so many cases where the message the company sent about somebody leaving was really different that I no longer believe anything except what the person says.
  - rohit2412 9y ago
    Does anybody else find it incredibly weird? They were able to manufacture batteries for 50k+ Model S/X. But couldn't scale the same batteries for Model 3?
    - slfnflctd 9y ago
      The Model 3 batteries are a somewhat different form factor from what Tesla has used in the past ('18650' are the old ones, '2170' the new), and might have slightly different chemistry as well. Here's one source on it, with a few more details: https://electrek.co/2017/08/24/tesla-model-3-exclusive-battery-pack-architecture/ https://electrek.co/2017/08/24/tesla-model-3-exclusive-batte...
jbob2000 9y ago
> he is launching a battery and powertrain startup in California I'm betting Tesla couldn't pay him enough and he's starting his own shop to sell to the other major auto manufacturers.
- samstave 9y ago
  Plus didn’t Tesla state that all their patents were open source, so there is no IP precluding him from doing such...
  - katastic 9y ago
    How about a non-compete agreement?
    - apendleton 9y ago
      Aren't they invalid in California?
  - apendleton 9y ago
    There might also be trade secrets he'd be precluded from disclosing by an NDA. (No idea if there actually are, but patents wouldn't be the only potential barrier.)
  - foota 9y ago
    Tesla likely has trade secrets that they do not release? And I believe using such in a new company would not be legal (ianal).
  - vkou 9y ago
    Without Tesla publishing a license that explicitly specifies this, you'd be insane to use Tesla's patents in your own product. That's the reason why nobody in the auto industry has taken them up on it. It's not a demonstration of good faith - it was a publicity stunt.
- beat 9y ago
  I doubt it's for the money. I'm sure he made a pretty penny on his stock options, and stood to make more. But he could get yelled at by Elon Musk every day, or he could walk into any VC in Silicon Valley, drop his own name, and have a fat stack of VC cash to gamble on something of his own design.
iMuzz 9y ago
> According to Wagner’s LinkedIn page, he is launching a battery and powertrain startup in California. It seems like he left to start his own company?
elihu 9y ago
That's conjecture. There are many reasons why a person might leave a company, and not all of them are because the person is unhappy with the company or the company is unhappy with the person. I'd rather we didn't jump to conclusions in the absence of evidence.
- dogruck 9y ago
  You are correct that it’s conjecture. I did include the weasel word “probably.” I certainly do not have inside info. But, in the real world, if he were interviewing for a new job, the prospective employer would surely have this conversation: Q: So, why did you leave Tesla? A: Oh, just felt like it was time to go. Wanted to start my own thing. Q: Ok. But, didn’t your departure coincide with the announcement that the Model 3’s primary production bottleneck was with assembly of the battery pack? A: Yes, but that was just a coincidence. I had been talking about leaving for a while. Q: Ok. Would you mind if we talked with 3 references from Tesla? Perhaps your direct manager, a peer, and one of your subordinates? A: Sure.....

Let’s be real — he was probably asked to leave.

r00fus 9y ago

Real question is why.

ChuckMcM 9y ago
The implication being of course that as the head of the division responsible for making batteries, he took the fall for not enough batteries available to sell product. What is interesting about that implication though is that while to me and others it seems "clearly" implied, there isn't any one thing you would point to that says it is what it is. I have seen so many cases where the message the company sent about somebody leaving was really different that I no longer believe anything except what the person says.
- rohit2412 9y ago
  Does anybody else find it incredibly weird? They were able to manufacture batteries for 50k+ Model S/X. But couldn't scale the same batteries for Model 3?
  - slfnflctd 9y ago
    The Model 3 batteries are a somewhat different form factor from what Tesla has used in the past ('18650' are the old ones, '2170' the new), and might have slightly different chemistry as well. Here's one source on it, with a few more details: https://electrek.co/2017/08/24/tesla-model-3-exclusive-battery-pack-architecture/ https://electrek.co/2017/08/24/tesla-model-3-exclusive-batte...

jbob2000 9y ago

> he is launching a battery and powertrain startup in California I'm betting Tesla couldn't pay him enough and he's starting his own shop to sell to the other major auto manufacturers.

samstave 9y ago
Plus didn’t Tesla state that all their patents were open source, so there is no IP precluding him from doing such...
- katastic 9y ago
  How about a non-compete agreement?
  - apendleton 9y ago
    Aren't they invalid in California?
- apendleton 9y ago
  There might also be trade secrets he'd be precluded from disclosing by an NDA. (No idea if there actually are, but patents wouldn't be the only potential barrier.)
- foota 9y ago
  Tesla likely has trade secrets that they do not release? And I believe using such in a new company would not be legal (ianal).
- vkou 9y ago
  Without Tesla publishing a license that explicitly specifies this, you'd be insane to use Tesla's patents in your own product. That's the reason why nobody in the auto industry has taken them up on it. It's not a demonstration of good faith - it was a publicity stunt.
beat 9y ago
I doubt it's for the money. I'm sure he made a pretty penny on his stock options, and stood to make more. But he could get yelled at by Elon Musk every day, or he could walk into any VC in Silicon Valley, drop his own name, and have a fat stack of VC cash to gamble on something of his own design.

iMuzz 9y ago

> According to Wagner’s LinkedIn page, he is launching a battery and powertrain startup in California. It seems like he left to start his own company?

elihu 9y ago

That's conjecture. There are many reasons why a person might leave a company, and not all of them are because the person is unhappy with the company or the company is unhappy with the person. I'd rather we didn't jump to conclusions in the absence of evidence.

dogruck 9y ago
You are correct that it’s conjecture. I did include the weasel word “probably.” I certainly do not have inside info. But, in the real world, if he were interviewing for a new job, the prospective employer would surely have this conversation: Q: So, why did you leave Tesla? A: Oh, just felt like it was time to go. Wanted to start my own thing. Q: Ok. But, didn’t your departure coincide with the announcement that the Model 3’s primary production bottleneck was with assembly of the battery pack? A: Yes, but that was just a coincidence. I had been talking about leaving for a while. Q: Ok. Would you mind if we talked with 3 references from Tesla? Perhaps your direct manager, a peer, and one of your subordinates? A: Sure.....