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To anyone that has kept track of geopolitical news across the last 20 years, it is obvious that no one in Russia gets rich without the approval of Kremlin. The

To anyone that has kept track of geopolitical news across the last 20 years, it is obvious that no one in Russia gets rich without the approval of Kremlin. The fact that Yuri Milner is walking the earth is sufficient evidence that he's friendly with the Kremlin. No one who managed to rise to the rank of CEO would misunderstand the unstated implication that a request from an associate of Yuri Milner is a request that is at least done with the approval of the Russian government, so in that case, just the same amount of digging would be done as with Tencent.

JumpCrisscross 9y ago
> The fact that Yuri Milner is walking the earth is sufficient evidence that he's friendly with the Kremlin You're moving goalposts. Nobody is worried about someone being friendly with the Kremlin. Acting at their behest, however, is new and troubling. (I agree that this should have been obvious. Unfortunately, when dollars start dancing people tend to rationalize.)
- smsm42 9y ago
  What constitutes "acting at their behest" that Milner did and Saudi, Chinese, etc. foreign investors did not? I suspect that this Red Scare is trying somehow to present doing any business with Russians as a crime, while a) avoiding to explain how it is different from doing business with Saudis, Chinese, Pakistanis, Qatarians or any other countries with centralized power structures and questionable records in freedom & human rights department; and b) trying to expose specific dealings as nefarious while neglecting to mention same dealings in other areas at all and explain why those are OK. Since it is in fashion to bash SV now, here is an article how SV is basically owned by Putin. Do you want to look at other Russian investments, maybe? At all people getting investments linked to Russia or lobbying for Russians or having business linked to any part of Russian money? Nah, that probably would upset to many people. Let's concentrate on Silicon Valley now.
- YuriNiyazov 9y ago
  Ok. I'll bite. Where, in the linked NYT article, is evidence that Kremlin gave orders to do X and not Y (rather than just cash) to Milner?
  - JumpCrisscross 9y ago
    > evidence that Kremlin gave orders to do X and not Y Again, you're moving the goalposts. Others [1][2][3] have directly responded to you on this point. Arguing that there is no need for alarm until some undefined threshold of red-handed evidence is attained is silly. If a state-backed investor invests in your company, and you don't know about it, that's cause for alarm in itself. It means you need to review, very carefully, what you told whom, when, and what actions you took at their behest. From a corporate level, it's similar to what e.g. SpaceX would be expected to do if it discovered Lockheed Martin invested in it through a front. At a national level, state involvement adds extra dimensions. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15631661 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15631661 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15631645 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15631645 [3] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15631654 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15631654
    - YuriNiyazov 9y ago
      In that case, I am really confused about what the point that's being made here is. > If a state-backed investor invests in your company, and you don't know about it, that's cause for alarm in itself. Is the only difference between today and yesterday is that yesterday there was no direct evidence that rich people associated ("backed by", "working in" - I am not sure what terminology you prefer to suggest nefariousness) with the Kremlin gave Milner cash to invest? If that's the concern, then, once again - anyone who believed yesterday that Milner was not $funded (once again, insert preferred terminology) at least partially by the Kremlin is an idiot. All they had to do was ask someone who is an immigrant from the Soviet Union.
      - JumpCrisscross 9y ago
        > anyone who believed yesterday that Milner was not $funded (once again, insert preferred terminology) by the Kremlin is an idiot Then more of us are idiots than you give credit for :). At the very least, I was an idiot and pg was an idiot [1][2]. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3143894 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3143894 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3144475 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3144475
- loblollyboy 9y ago
  The two are synonymous. I'm not Russian, but I study the language for some reason and know way too much about their politics

JumpCrisscross 9y ago

> The fact that Yuri Milner is walking the earth is sufficient evidence that he's friendly with the Kremlin You're moving goalposts. Nobody is worried about someone being friendly with the Kremlin. Acting at their behest, however, is new and troubling. (I agree that this should have been obvious. Unfortunately, when dollars start dancing people tend to rationalize.)

smsm42 9y ago
What constitutes "acting at their behest" that Milner did and Saudi, Chinese, etc. foreign investors did not? I suspect that this Red Scare is trying somehow to present doing any business with Russians as a crime, while a) avoiding to explain how it is different from doing business with Saudis, Chinese, Pakistanis, Qatarians or any other countries with centralized power structures and questionable records in freedom & human rights department; and b) trying to expose specific dealings as nefarious while neglecting to mention same dealings in other areas at all and explain why those are OK. Since it is in fashion to bash SV now, here is an article how SV is basically owned by Putin. Do you want to look at other Russian investments, maybe? At all people getting investments linked to Russia or lobbying for Russians or having business linked to any part of Russian money? Nah, that probably would upset to many people. Let's concentrate on Silicon Valley now.
YuriNiyazov 9y ago
Ok. I'll bite. Where, in the linked NYT article, is evidence that Kremlin gave orders to do X and not Y (rather than just cash) to Milner?
- JumpCrisscross 9y ago
  > evidence that Kremlin gave orders to do X and not Y Again, you're moving the goalposts. Others [1][2][3] have directly responded to you on this point. Arguing that there is no need for alarm until some undefined threshold of red-handed evidence is attained is silly. If a state-backed investor invests in your company, and you don't know about it, that's cause for alarm in itself. It means you need to review, very carefully, what you told whom, when, and what actions you took at their behest. From a corporate level, it's similar to what e.g. SpaceX would be expected to do if it discovered Lockheed Martin invested in it through a front. At a national level, state involvement adds extra dimensions. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15631661 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15631661 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15631645 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15631645 [3] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15631654 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=15631654
  - YuriNiyazov 9y ago
    In that case, I am really confused about what the point that's being made here is. > If a state-backed investor invests in your company, and you don't know about it, that's cause for alarm in itself. Is the only difference between today and yesterday is that yesterday there was no direct evidence that rich people associated ("backed by", "working in" - I am not sure what terminology you prefer to suggest nefariousness) with the Kremlin gave Milner cash to invest? If that's the concern, then, once again - anyone who believed yesterday that Milner was not $funded (once again, insert preferred terminology) at least partially by the Kremlin is an idiot. All they had to do was ask someone who is an immigrant from the Soviet Union.
    - JumpCrisscross 9y ago
      > anyone who believed yesterday that Milner was not $funded (once again, insert preferred terminology) by the Kremlin is an idiot Then more of us are idiots than you give credit for :). At the very least, I was an idiot and pg was an idiot [1][2]. [1] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3143894 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3143894 [2] https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3144475 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3144475
loblollyboy 9y ago
The two are synonymous. I'm not Russian, but I study the language for some reason and know way too much about their politics