3 ms·

This is incredible. As we approach the technological capability of direct brain-to-brain communication, cases like this serve as an example of what is in store

by namlem 9y ago

This is incredible. As we approach the technological capability of direct brain-to-brain communication, cases like this serve as an example of what is in store for us. Our brains are in some sense already multiple consciousness that communicate and collaborate with one another. It could be that connecting to other minds is more natural than we might realize.

xenadu02 9y ago
I think the same thing; this seems like the best evidence we have to date that given sufficient technology it should be possible to communicate in thought between two people. I’d imagine any such system would have a learning curve as each brain figures out the patterns but it seems there isn’t any fundamental difference that makes each person’s thoughts unintelligible. (Granted, as siblings one could argue their thoughts would naturally tend toward being intelligible but it seems too early to know the answer to that question)
- jstanley 9y ago
  Perhaps literal "thoughtcrime" could become a reality some time soon.
  - inetknght 9y ago
    And you think that would be a good thing?
- Asraelite 9y ago
  Being joined from birth, any and all memories and experiences formed in their brains that could be shared were shared, and so they would have similar associations and mental pathways formed based on them. While it may be possible to learn and figure out patterns from someone else that you were connected to, I think it would be immensely difficult. You may have to learn the whole world from their point of view from scratch for any mental relations they communicate to have any meaning.
- failrate 9y ago
  Direct mind-to-mind communication, as hard as that is, will not be the primary challenge. Safety and defensive mechanisms will be far more challenging. We already have invasive techniques that use nothing more than images, sound, text. Direct mind access would make techniques that were far more dangerous and insidious.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
everdev 9y ago
I wonder if verbal and written communication will still be preferable as it's less noise. Even if I want to send you a thought, I could get distracted and start thinking things unrelated, or something I'm not supposed to share like IP.
hyperpallium 9y ago
Compare it to communicating between computers, by serializing data structures into some common format (not just xml or json, but particular format or schema within that, with particular semantics). There's a practical matter of requiring a wire format for transmission, but the translation to a coomon form (interface) allows the data structures to differ markedly. In practice, different programs performing a similar task are often written quite similarly - form follows function, and also convetion (e.g. "x,y" for coords). But some parts still differ, especially when the alternatives have comparable efficacy, and more so when the purpose differs. It's an instance of information-hiding, where an API or interface decouples implementation details. Similarly, we serialize our internal representations into language for - literally - serialization. It's for transmission, but also allows differing internal representations.
- Grustaf 9y ago
  One point to note is that intra-brain (and in this case inter-brain) communication is anything but serial.
andy_ppp 9y ago
No, this isn't going to work like that; these girls have had incredible levels of plasticity in their brains to be able to accommodate each other's functions in ways that are difficult for anyone but them to comprehend. Take for example the case of people who have never seen from birth and are given sight through retinal implants; they can see colours and images and patterns but their brains can make no sense of the input - they sense no depth, shapes, relations between words and images, shadows meaning three dimensionality, etc. etc. that we all take for granted. Those neurones have been put to alternative use already and in some ways you really can't teach an old dog new tricks.
- namlem 9y ago
  That is true, however there are some drugs that have been shown to increase plasticity and stimulate neuronal growth. And there's also the possibility of doping the brain with stem cells.
- a_rahmanshah 9y ago
  Wow! That's something to ponder upon...
- BearGoesChirp 9y ago
  I think one of the simplest ways to illustrate this is with sounds. Humans who spend their early years in an environment devoid of certain sounds lose the ability to differentiate those sounds. The classical example that many seem aware of are Japanese speakers who have trouble distinguishing l and r sounds. Every language has some sounds missing, and so any given person should be able to find two sounds they can't distinguish unless they were raised in a multi-lingual household from birth which covered all the sounds.

by namlem 9y ago

xenadu02 9y ago

I think the same thing; this seems like the best evidence we have to date that given sufficient technology it should be possible to communicate in thought between two people. I’d imagine any such system would have a learning curve as each brain figures out the patterns but it seems there isn’t any fundamental difference that makes each person’s thoughts unintelligible. (Granted, as siblings one could argue their thoughts would naturally tend toward being intelligible but it seems too early to know the answer to that question)

jstanley 9y ago
Perhaps literal "thoughtcrime" could become a reality some time soon.
- inetknght 9y ago
  And you think that would be a good thing?
Asraelite 9y ago
Being joined from birth, any and all memories and experiences formed in their brains that could be shared were shared, and so they would have similar associations and mental pathways formed based on them. While it may be possible to learn and figure out patterns from someone else that you were connected to, I think it would be immensely difficult. You may have to learn the whole world from their point of view from scratch for any mental relations they communicate to have any meaning.
failrate 9y ago
Direct mind-to-mind communication, as hard as that is, will not be the primary challenge. Safety and defensive mechanisms will be far more challenging. We already have invasive techniques that use nothing more than images, sound, text. Direct mind access would make techniques that were far more dangerous and insidious.

deleted 9y ago

[deleted]

everdev 9y ago

I wonder if verbal and written communication will still be preferable as it's less noise. Even if I want to send you a thought, I could get distracted and start thinking things unrelated, or something I'm not supposed to share like IP.

hyperpallium 9y ago

Compare it to communicating between computers, by serializing data structures into some common format (not just xml or json, but particular format or schema within that, with particular semantics). There's a practical matter of requiring a wire format for transmission, but the translation to a coomon form (interface) allows the data structures to differ markedly. In practice, different programs performing a similar task are often written quite similarly - form follows function, and also convetion (e.g. "x,y" for coords). But some parts still differ, especially when the alternatives have comparable efficacy, and more so when the purpose differs. It's an instance of information-hiding, where an API or interface decouples implementation details. Similarly, we serialize our internal representations into language for - literally - serialization. It's for transmission, but also allows differing internal representations.

Grustaf 9y ago
One point to note is that intra-brain (and in this case inter-brain) communication is anything but serial.

andy_ppp 9y ago

No, this isn't going to work like that; these girls have had incredible levels of plasticity in their brains to be able to accommodate each other's functions in ways that are difficult for anyone but them to comprehend. Take for example the case of people who have never seen from birth and are given sight through retinal implants; they can see colours and images and patterns but their brains can make no sense of the input - they sense no depth, shapes, relations between words and images, shadows meaning three dimensionality, etc. etc. that we all take for granted. Those neurones have been put to alternative use already and in some ways you really can't teach an old dog new tricks.

namlem 9y ago
That is true, however there are some drugs that have been shown to increase plasticity and stimulate neuronal growth. And there's also the possibility of doping the brain with stem cells.
a_rahmanshah 9y ago
Wow! That's something to ponder upon...
BearGoesChirp 9y ago
I think one of the simplest ways to illustrate this is with sounds. Humans who spend their early years in an environment devoid of certain sounds lose the ability to differentiate those sounds. The classical example that many seem aware of are Japanese speakers who have trouble distinguishing l and r sounds. Every language has some sounds missing, and so any given person should be able to find two sounds they can't distinguish unless they were raised in a multi-lingual household from birth which covered all the sounds.