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This is the problem I see with decentralized projects. The user experience here, is essentially the same as WeTransfer. The only difference is the underlying t

This is the problem I see with decentralized projects. The user experience here, is essentially the same as WeTransfer. The only difference is the underlying technologies. Now, one would have to either blindly trust that the infrastructure is truly decentralized, or have the time and necessary skills to audit the code. And then they'd have to trust that web server is actually hooking up to the code that was just audited! What this means is, "decentralized" projects still require a level of trust, even on the behalf of people who understand what decentralization means. Next is the problem of the "masses". They already are using WeTransfer, or Dropbox for that matter. Why should they switch to this? Because it's decentralized? Now you have to explain to them what that means and why that's beneficial to them, and if you're successful there, they still have to: trust the code (and they only can do that by understanding it) and trust that you're actually deploying that code on your live interface. Thus, the decentralization community has got a marketing problem. Fortunately for Bitcoin they've got and continue to have massive amounts of free press, press which does not even actually highlight the decentralized aspect of Bitcoin, just the price action. There is no press movement to help catapult "decentralized infrastructure." I'm just saying, decentralized projects currently only seem to appeal to people who are interested in decentralization. There needs to be a way to move pass this hurdle if there's going to be the much sought after "mass adoption." The average person doesn't care how something works, they just care that it does work. And plenty solutions already work for them. I just hope in the end, we aren't just tinkering for the sake of tinkering.

Joeboy 9y ago
Recent reports of google docs arbitrarily removing people's access to their documents seem like pretty good marketing for decentralized solutions.
- crazygringo 9y ago
  That was a bug. Are you saying decentralized solutions won't ever have bugs which temporarily prevent people from accessing certain files until the bug gets fixed?
  - contravariant 9y ago
    If a bug on your end could prevent other people from accessing data then I wouldn't call that decentralised.
  - johnchristopher 9y ago
    Comparative marketing doesn't hold anything back. Remember the 'opensource/Linux is a cancer ' mantra ?
  - Piskvorrr 9y ago
    The bug was "we blocked data as we habitually do, but we reasoned incorrectly on what to block," not "we blocked data by accident, blocking itself is a bug". Same outcome, radically different rationale.
mtgx 9y ago
> I just hope in the end, we aren't just tinkering for the sake of tinkering. I don't think we are. IPFS is one of the few projects that gives me hope that within 10 years the internet won't be completely carved-up and censored by the big tech companies and governments.
alexsicart 9y ago
But for example, wetransfer only allow to upload 2GB files, my proposal unlimited and permanent. I believe people don't need to know it uses blockchain...
- charlesdm 9y ago
  That's a feature, not a product. I'm assuming you can transfer larger files through WeChat if you pay? I believe decentralised systems serve a purpose (especially in fintech), but I'm not sure this solves an actual a problem (marketing it will be 10,000 harder than building it). Also, as a business open sourcing stuff hardly ever makes sense. Not sure what your goal was with this (cool tech though!) but if it was to set up a business, I don't think that was a great decision.
  - alexsicart 9y ago
    censorhip? Here in my country, there are webpages blocked(blocking dns). We see there is a lot of censorhip on the internet. IPFS is permanent, anyone can't eliminate that content. You can get access, with lots of gateways.
alexsicart 9y ago
I believe we should build distributed projects, seems equally to products already people love, but using great tech as ipfs, to have permanent and unlimited files.
- transitorykris 9y ago
  Large, unlimited, and permanent files sounds great to the average person. One nitpick I have with the IPFS crowd is the use of the word 'permanent'. They know exactly what it means, but the connotation for the average person is incorrect (persistent data for the latter, permanent address for the former). The marketing problems run deep.
alexsicart 9y ago
Because this tech, need to be visible to HUMANS if we want to create the next internet.
alexasmyths 9y ago
"Thus, the decentralization community has got a marketing problem." Yes, and it's because security is a feature, not a solution. 99% of people (think your Mother, or your non-techie buddy back home) - do not care that much about these things. 'The feature' they care about is 'sharing'. They can already get that robustly via regular services. So maybe 'it's nice' to have some degree of extra privacy', but not if they actually have to do something, think about it, install something - yada yada. For a select few, privacy/security is in and of itself a feature, and might be a primary motivation for use/purchase, but it's a small group. Example: intellectually, I care about the issue, but really, I could care less that Instagram has 3 of my photos, or that FB has a very small number of posts that I've made. I believe the 'decentralization' movement will happen when: A) On the consumer side it's easy, obvious, there is a push - and possibly when adoption isn't necessarily driven by the decentralized nature, rather, something else, a 'benefit' that is derived B) Enterprise. They will definitely not want their data out in the world willy nilly. Think of how much critical data Salesforce has for example. After a few more leaks, it could be that CIO's everywhere demand more 'on premise' and this could be an opening for more decentralized services.
jani123 9y ago
I agree with you on the ¨they already are using WeTransfer, or Dropbox for that matter. Why should they switch to this? Because it's decentralized? Now you have to explain to them what that means and why that's beneficial to them, and if you're successful there, they still have to: trust the code (and they only can do that by understanding it) and trust that you're actually deploying that code on your live interface. But is it a good argument?
xj9 9y ago
how do Dropbox, Google Drive, iCloud Drive, &c. compete? they have similar features, pricing, &c. dex tech doesn't have to be radically different to be competitive, it just has to be good, fast, and have a competitive angle of some kind: perf, price, privacy, &c. a more interesting angle, imo, is to create an alternative to the GOOG/APPL/MSFT mobile/desktop platforms using free software and dex tech. a lot of the stuff will be the same, people want music, photos, video, social, but I also hope that the p2p architecture will inspire a lot of novel ideas that will only be available inside of our freedom garden. #heropunch:matrix.org

Joeboy 9y ago

Recent reports of google docs arbitrarily removing people's access to their documents seem like pretty good marketing for decentralized solutions.

crazygringo 9y ago
That was a bug. Are you saying decentralized solutions won't ever have bugs which temporarily prevent people from accessing certain files until the bug gets fixed?
- contravariant 9y ago
  If a bug on your end could prevent other people from accessing data then I wouldn't call that decentralised.
- johnchristopher 9y ago
  Comparative marketing doesn't hold anything back. Remember the 'opensource/Linux is a cancer ' mantra ?
- Piskvorrr 9y ago
  The bug was "we blocked data as we habitually do, but we reasoned incorrectly on what to block," not "we blocked data by accident, blocking itself is a bug". Same outcome, radically different rationale.

mtgx 9y ago

> I just hope in the end, we aren't just tinkering for the sake of tinkering. I don't think we are. IPFS is one of the few projects that gives me hope that within 10 years the internet won't be completely carved-up and censored by the big tech companies and governments.

alexsicart 9y ago

But for example, wetransfer only allow to upload 2GB files, my proposal unlimited and permanent. I believe people don't need to know it uses blockchain...

charlesdm 9y ago
That's a feature, not a product. I'm assuming you can transfer larger files through WeChat if you pay? I believe decentralised systems serve a purpose (especially in fintech), but I'm not sure this solves an actual a problem (marketing it will be 10,000 harder than building it). Also, as a business open sourcing stuff hardly ever makes sense. Not sure what your goal was with this (cool tech though!) but if it was to set up a business, I don't think that was a great decision.
- alexsicart 9y ago
  censorhip? Here in my country, there are webpages blocked(blocking dns). We see there is a lot of censorhip on the internet. IPFS is permanent, anyone can't eliminate that content. You can get access, with lots of gateways.

alexsicart 9y ago

I believe we should build distributed projects, seems equally to products already people love, but using great tech as ipfs, to have permanent and unlimited files.

transitorykris 9y ago
Large, unlimited, and permanent files sounds great to the average person. One nitpick I have with the IPFS crowd is the use of the word 'permanent'. They know exactly what it means, but the connotation for the average person is incorrect (persistent data for the latter, permanent address for the former). The marketing problems run deep.

alexsicart 9y ago

Because this tech, need to be visible to HUMANS if we want to create the next internet.

alexasmyths 9y ago

"Thus, the decentralization community has got a marketing problem." Yes, and it's because security is a feature, not a solution. 99% of people (think your Mother, or your non-techie buddy back home) - do not care that much about these things. 'The feature' they care about is 'sharing'. They can already get that robustly via regular services. So maybe 'it's nice' to have some degree of extra privacy', but not if they actually have to do something, think about it, install something - yada yada. For a select few, privacy/security is in and of itself a feature, and might be a primary motivation for use/purchase, but it's a small group. Example: intellectually, I care about the issue, but really, I could care less that Instagram has 3 of my photos, or that FB has a very small number of posts that I've made. I believe the 'decentralization' movement will happen when: A) On the consumer side it's easy, obvious, there is a push - and possibly when adoption isn't necessarily driven by the decentralized nature, rather, something else, a 'benefit' that is derived B) Enterprise. They will definitely not want their data out in the world willy nilly. Think of how much critical data Salesforce has for example. After a few more leaks, it could be that CIO's everywhere demand more 'on premise' and this could be an opening for more decentralized services.

jani123 9y ago

I agree with you on the ¨they already are using WeTransfer, or Dropbox for that matter. Why should they switch to this? Because it's decentralized? Now you have to explain to them what that means and why that's beneficial to them, and if you're successful there, they still have to: trust the code (and they only can do that by understanding it) and trust that you're actually deploying that code on your live interface. But is it a good argument?

xj9 9y ago

how do Dropbox, Google Drive, iCloud Drive, &c. compete? they have similar features, pricing, &c. dex tech doesn't have to be radically different to be competitive, it just has to be good, fast, and have a competitive angle of some kind: perf, price, privacy, &c. a more interesting angle, imo, is to create an alternative to the GOOG/APPL/MSFT mobile/desktop platforms using free software and dex tech. a lot of the stuff will be the same, people want music, photos, video, social, but I also hope that the p2p architecture will inspire a lot of novel ideas that will only be available inside of our freedom garden. #heropunch:matrix.org