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I'm trying to figure out how this would be decentralised. As far as I understand, merely hosting something on IPFS doesn't make it decentralised if there is onl

by monokh 9y ago

I'm trying to figure out how this would be decentralised. As far as I understand, merely hosting something on IPFS doesn't make it decentralised if there is only one node. - Where is my file hosted when I receive it? - Has your server pinned and seeding that file? - Is there a distributed set of nodes that also host it?

alexsicart 9y ago
fully distributed
mtgx 9y ago
> As far as I understand, merely hosting something on IPFS doesn't make it decentralised if there is only one node. Doesn't that apply to torrents, too? If 2 or more people don't own (and share) the exact same content, then of course it's not decentralized.
- alexsicart 9y ago
  It's not the same torrents than ipfs, completely different!! https://ipfs.io/ https://ipfs.io/
- monokh 9y ago
  Sure, I guess the difference is, torrents have an inherent mechanism of becoming distributed. Once someone else has a whole/part of the file, they begin seeding immediately (unless stopped of course). In the case of this app, I just receive a download link which is a proxy for pulling something from the network. It would be something else, if the way to get a hold of this file would be through an IPFS node that the user was running.
  - StavrosK 9y ago
    I'm not really sure what you mean. IPFS works just like torrents. As soon as you receive the file, you start "seeding" it.
    - monokh 9y ago
      Yes it does. But I don't believe this app is using any actual seeding mechanisms of IPFS from a user perspective. Which is why i'm asking about where the nodes would be to make this distributed and decentralised. My guess is that the server of this project uploads and "pins" this file in IPFS, in which case it would be no different than a centralised solution. If the server goes down, your file is unaccessible. Also, when you use this app, you aren't doing this through an IPFS node to then be able to seed it. You are just downloading the already hosted file using a HTTP proxy service that can download from IPFS.
      - alexsicart 9y ago
        the server never goes down, because is not like TORRENTS!
      - StavrosK 9y ago
        > But I don't believe this app is using any actual seeding mechanisms of IPFS from a user perspective I'm not sure what you mean here. Any user can "seed" any IPFS file they want, they don't need anything from this service. > in which case it would be no different than a centralised solution A distributed solution with N=1 isn't the same as a centralized solution. The difference is that distributed solutions can easily increase N, but centralized solutions can't. In this case, you can distribute the file from as many nodes as you control, which makes this service much better than a centralized solution. > Also, when you use this app, you aren't doing this through an IPFS node to then be able to seed it Sure, but you can use something like www.eternum.io (or just run your own IPFS node) to fix that. If you don't want to do either, of course you won't have any of the advantages. It's like saying "cars aren't better than couches, they aren't much more comfortable and they don't run if you don't start the engine".
        alexsicart 9y ago
        this project is running an ipfs node in your browser Also, is not like torrents, if disconnect your node, the file disappears!! Read IPFS docs please
  - hanklazard 9y ago
    >It would be something else, if the way to get a hold of this file would be through an IPFS node that the user was running. I agree, this seems to sort of bypass IPFS on the download side because my mom doesn’t have to have a node running to download the picture I send her. However, one potential benefit of this service could be to act as a foot-in-the-door to gain a user base ... I could imagine a .dmg /.exe in the future setting up an IPFS node for your average non-techie user. Still, that doesn’t solve the problem of competing with existing & simple centralized solutions with similar features, as noted in other comments. Glad to see people building projects with IPFS. Nice work.
- tinus_hn 9y ago
  If you only send a download link to one person, how would there be multiple people sharing the same content?

by monokh 9y ago

alexsicart 9y ago

fully distributed

mtgx 9y ago

> As far as I understand, merely hosting something on IPFS doesn't make it decentralised if there is only one node. Doesn't that apply to torrents, too? If 2 or more people don't own (and share) the exact same content, then of course it's not decentralized.

alexsicart 9y ago
It's not the same torrents than ipfs, completely different!! https://ipfs.io/ https://ipfs.io/
monokh 9y ago
Sure, I guess the difference is, torrents have an inherent mechanism of becoming distributed. Once someone else has a whole/part of the file, they begin seeding immediately (unless stopped of course). In the case of this app, I just receive a download link which is a proxy for pulling something from the network. It would be something else, if the way to get a hold of this file would be through an IPFS node that the user was running.
- StavrosK 9y ago
  I'm not really sure what you mean. IPFS works just like torrents. As soon as you receive the file, you start "seeding" it.
  - monokh 9y ago
    Yes it does. But I don't believe this app is using any actual seeding mechanisms of IPFS from a user perspective. Which is why i'm asking about where the nodes would be to make this distributed and decentralised. My guess is that the server of this project uploads and "pins" this file in IPFS, in which case it would be no different than a centralised solution. If the server goes down, your file is unaccessible. Also, when you use this app, you aren't doing this through an IPFS node to then be able to seed it. You are just downloading the already hosted file using a HTTP proxy service that can download from IPFS.
    - alexsicart 9y ago
      the server never goes down, because is not like TORRENTS!
    - StavrosK 9y ago
      > But I don't believe this app is using any actual seeding mechanisms of IPFS from a user perspective I'm not sure what you mean here. Any user can "seed" any IPFS file they want, they don't need anything from this service. > in which case it would be no different than a centralised solution A distributed solution with N=1 isn't the same as a centralized solution. The difference is that distributed solutions can easily increase N, but centralized solutions can't. In this case, you can distribute the file from as many nodes as you control, which makes this service much better than a centralized solution. > Also, when you use this app, you aren't doing this through an IPFS node to then be able to seed it Sure, but you can use something like www.eternum.io (or just run your own IPFS node) to fix that. If you don't want to do either, of course you won't have any of the advantages. It's like saying "cars aren't better than couches, they aren't much more comfortable and they don't run if you don't start the engine".
      - alexsicart 9y ago
        this project is running an ipfs node in your browser Also, is not like torrents, if disconnect your node, the file disappears!! Read IPFS docs please
- hanklazard 9y ago
  >It would be something else, if the way to get a hold of this file would be through an IPFS node that the user was running. I agree, this seems to sort of bypass IPFS on the download side because my mom doesn’t have to have a node running to download the picture I send her. However, one potential benefit of this service could be to act as a foot-in-the-door to gain a user base ... I could imagine a .dmg /.exe in the future setting up an IPFS node for your average non-techie user. Still, that doesn’t solve the problem of competing with existing & simple centralized solutions with similar features, as noted in other comments. Glad to see people building projects with IPFS. Nice work.
tinus_hn 9y ago
If you only send a download link to one person, how would there be multiple people sharing the same content?