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I see this as a valid point. You don't need Tor for that, any local app could proxy a connection that way. But, yes, it is a useful side effect of Tor.

gpm 9y ago
I mean, it's a free way to have a persistent internet address, which is interesting. And in doing so you contribute to the usefulness of Tor, since it relies on people using it to create an anonymity set.
zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC 9y ago
First of all, actually, no, a "local app" can't do that. The problem is that the machine doesn't have a globally reachable address, and that's not something that you can solve by changing the software on the machine, you need some external service that provides you with a globally reachable address and a way to forward connection requests for that address to your machine. That is a service that the Tor network provides. Obviously, Tor is not the only solution to this problem, but it is one that has the nice property that you don't need to register any accounts, you don't need to pay for anything, the availability of the Tor network is pretty good ... Also I am not so sure I would call it a side effect, for two reasons: 1. Any application that grows the anonymity set of Tor is useful for the goals of the Tor network. Even if your SSH session does not have any use for the anonymity that Tor provides, it still is good for the Tor network that you add cover traffic to the network for those who need it. 2. Decentralization has a lot of overlap with anonymity, and as such I would consider this use actually to be well within the use cases that Tor is intended for: ISPs build networks that increaslingly make it difficult to use your own devices for anything more than consuming content that is delivered from the network, thus contributing to the growth of the kind of centralized services that don't provide any anonymity at all. Using Tor to access your own machines and thus enabling you to build infrastructure that is not inspected by third parties is very much aligned with the goals of the Tor project.
- wybiral 9y ago
  I care more about security and privacy than anonymity. IPFS or Keybase seem like better approaches towards those goals. And, yes, Tor makes sense if you need to hide your IP address. But beyond that I don't see much further use.
  - zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC 9y ago
    I don't think many people care about anonymity as a primary value. Anonymity is simply one tool to achieve privacy and security against certain types of risks/attacks.

gpm 9y ago

I mean, it's a free way to have a persistent internet address, which is interesting. And in doing so you contribute to the usefulness of Tor, since it relies on people using it to create an anonymity set.

zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC 9y ago

First of all, actually, no, a "local app" can't do that. The problem is that the machine doesn't have a globally reachable address, and that's not something that you can solve by changing the software on the machine, you need some external service that provides you with a globally reachable address and a way to forward connection requests for that address to your machine. That is a service that the Tor network provides. Obviously, Tor is not the only solution to this problem, but it is one that has the nice property that you don't need to register any accounts, you don't need to pay for anything, the availability of the Tor network is pretty good ... Also I am not so sure I would call it a side effect, for two reasons: 1. Any application that grows the anonymity set of Tor is useful for the goals of the Tor network. Even if your SSH session does not have any use for the anonymity that Tor provides, it still is good for the Tor network that you add cover traffic to the network for those who need it. 2. Decentralization has a lot of overlap with anonymity, and as such I would consider this use actually to be well within the use cases that Tor is intended for: ISPs build networks that increaslingly make it difficult to use your own devices for anything more than consuming content that is delivered from the network, thus contributing to the growth of the kind of centralized services that don't provide any anonymity at all. Using Tor to access your own machines and thus enabling you to build infrastructure that is not inspected by third parties is very much aligned with the goals of the Tor project.

wybiral 9y ago
I care more about security and privacy than anonymity. IPFS or Keybase seem like better approaches towards those goals. And, yes, Tor makes sense if you need to hide your IP address. But beyond that I don't see much further use.
- zAy0LfpBZLC8mAC 9y ago
  I don't think many people care about anonymity as a primary value. Anonymity is simply one tool to achieve privacy and security against certain types of risks/attacks.