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The truth is you just can't outwork a bad diet. A milkshake is worth an hour's worth of treadmill work. Diets are not something that you just hop on for a sho

by rarec 9y ago

The truth is you just can't outwork a bad diet. A milkshake is worth an hour's worth of treadmill work. Diets are not something that you just hop on for a short time and leave, it's a lifestyle change. Some diets are more for short term benefit than others, like keto, but once you're down to a decent weight you have to manage it.

jonnycoder 9y ago
I completely agree about not being able to out work a bad diet. On the other hand, cardio activity actually reduces my appetite and fills me up faster, and thus I believe that cardio helps more in that area relative to the actual burning of calories.
- js2 9y ago
  Exercise and a good diet are virtuous cycle. However, as someone who runs a lot (7-14 hours/week), I can tell you that there is such a thing as being rungry. I actually find it easier to lose weight when I'm on the lower end of my mileage range. Also, it's easy to think "I ran so much, now I can eat more," which is a dangerous trap.
js2 9y ago
> A milkshake is worth an hour's worth of treadmill work. Not even. The Five Guys base milkshake is 870 calories before adding any mix-ins or whipped cream[1]. An hour on a treadmill at 6 mph for a 150 lb person is 567 calories net (exclusive of basal metabolism), 675 calories total (inclusive of basal metabolism)[2]. [1] http://www.fiveguys.com/-/media/Public-Site/Files/NutritionAllergensMarch2017US.ashx?la=en http://www.fiveguys.com/-/media/Public-Site/Files/NutritionA... [2] https://www.runnersworld.com/weight-loss/how-many-calories-are-you-really-burning https://www.runnersworld.com/weight-loss/how-many-calories-a...
- whatyoucantsay 9y ago
  And at 9 mph, they will burn over 1,000 kcal. https://www.runnersworld.com/tools/calories-burned-calculator https://www.runnersworld.com/tools/calories-burned-calculato...
  - marcc 9y ago
    6:40 per mile is a pretty intense pace for most people to keep up for an hour.
    - whatyoucantsay 9y ago
      Most people don't run much. Just as with hiking, strength straining, gymnastics and other sport, ability grows with training. Another option is simply running longer. Few people who aren't overweight couldn't train up to 90 minutes. Given that there's overhead in showering and changing clothes, going longer, fewer days per week does have an efficiency of sorts. Edit: Ideally one avoids having a completely irresponsible diet, however just training can do a lot and can also blunt the appetite after a certain threshold.
      - tj-teej 9y ago
        Running a 6:40 mile for an hour is outside of what most dedicated runners can achieve.
        whatyoucantsay 9y ago
        Don't be ridiculous. Ed Whitlock ran that pace for an entire marathon at the age of 73. If you're dedicated, under 50, free of serious ailments and anywhere near the weight range this thread used as an example, it's something you can almost definitely achieve for a single hour.
- deleted 9y ago
  [deleted]
- woolvalley 9y ago
  A hack I like to do with treadmills is to go 1.5-2 miles per hour and have an incline of 20-30%. You burn 600-800 calories but your going at walking speed. I call it the hiking simulator.
  - js2 9y ago
    I've never seen a treadmill that goes over 15% grade. 30% is almost a stair stepper.
    - woolvalley 9y ago
      Ah it is a pretty unique treadmill: https://www.freemotionfitness.com/cardio/incline-trainers https://www.freemotionfitness.com/cardio/incline-trainers They call it an incline trainer With stair steppers I found it a lot harder to sustain it for the same nominal calorie count. But going up a %30 incline vs a stair stepper might be the same difference between an elliptical vs running.
whatyoucantsay 9y ago
Then how did Courtney Dauwalter recently win the MOAB 240 race in Utah by over eight hours on a diet of nachos, candy and beer? She eats far more calories than a normal human could and is establishing new high marks in performance along the way. Not even the Tarahumara have put up her kind of numbers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8DfjXnIk6c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8DfjXnIk6c A single hour on the treadmill will burn over 1,000 kcal for most somewhat fit people. It also increases their insulin sensitivity. The truth is most westerners and especially Americans are far too sedentary.
- rarec 9y ago
  I'm not sure what you're getting at. She doesn't eat/drink those things all the time. Michael Phelps ate an enormous amount of food too for his training too, and he trained very hard. I sincerely doubt him or Courtney devour that many calories when not in training or trying to run for five plus days straight. Short term gorging yourself for fuel is sometimes necessary, but it's dishonest to propose that means a diet of nachos, candy and beer is somehow healthy. If everyone was doing the MOAB all the time that's a different story.
  - sushisource 9y ago
    You're definitely not wrong, but consistent long term training does keep you at a higher metabolic rate. I run pretty frequently (nothing like a ultra competition like that, though) and I can consistently eat ~3kcal a day and not gain a pound, even when maybe 1/3 to 1/2 of those days don't involve training. To be fair, I'm still young, and probably have a genetic predisposition to burning a lot of calories, but I still think it's fair to say that consistent training results in a generally higher caloric intake even when not training.
  - whatyoucantsay 9y ago
    The only thing I was pointing out is that people can, in fact, "outwork a bad diet". It's not easy, but it's not impossible either.
- gizmo686 9y ago
LyndsySimon 9y ago
> Some diets are more for short term benefit than others, like keto I've been on keto for ten months, and have lost ~70 pounds. I don't see it as a short-term change; I intend to spend the rest of my life either in ketosis or regularly spending time in that state.

by rarec 9y ago

jonnycoder 9y ago

I completely agree about not being able to out work a bad diet. On the other hand, cardio activity actually reduces my appetite and fills me up faster, and thus I believe that cardio helps more in that area relative to the actual burning of calories.

js2 9y ago
Exercise and a good diet are virtuous cycle. However, as someone who runs a lot (7-14 hours/week), I can tell you that there is such a thing as being rungry. I actually find it easier to lose weight when I'm on the lower end of my mileage range. Also, it's easy to think "I ran so much, now I can eat more," which is a dangerous trap.

js2 9y ago

> A milkshake is worth an hour's worth of treadmill work. Not even. The Five Guys base milkshake is 870 calories before adding any mix-ins or whipped cream[1]. An hour on a treadmill at 6 mph for a 150 lb person is 567 calories net (exclusive of basal metabolism), 675 calories total (inclusive of basal metabolism)[2]. [1] http://www.fiveguys.com/-/media/Public-Site/Files/NutritionAllergensMarch2017US.ashx?la=en http://www.fiveguys.com/-/media/Public-Site/Files/NutritionA... [2] https://www.runnersworld.com/weight-loss/how-many-calories-are-you-really-burning https://www.runnersworld.com/weight-loss/how-many-calories-a...

whatyoucantsay 9y ago
And at 9 mph, they will burn over 1,000 kcal. https://www.runnersworld.com/tools/calories-burned-calculator https://www.runnersworld.com/tools/calories-burned-calculato...
- marcc 9y ago
  6:40 per mile is a pretty intense pace for most people to keep up for an hour.
  - whatyoucantsay 9y ago
    Most people don't run much. Just as with hiking, strength straining, gymnastics and other sport, ability grows with training. Another option is simply running longer. Few people who aren't overweight couldn't train up to 90 minutes. Given that there's overhead in showering and changing clothes, going longer, fewer days per week does have an efficiency of sorts. Edit: Ideally one avoids having a completely irresponsible diet, however just training can do a lot and can also blunt the appetite after a certain threshold.
    - tj-teej 9y ago
      Running a 6:40 mile for an hour is outside of what most dedicated runners can achieve.
      - whatyoucantsay 9y ago
        Don't be ridiculous. Ed Whitlock ran that pace for an entire marathon at the age of 73. If you're dedicated, under 50, free of serious ailments and anywhere near the weight range this thread used as an example, it's something you can almost definitely achieve for a single hour.
deleted 9y ago
[deleted]
woolvalley 9y ago
A hack I like to do with treadmills is to go 1.5-2 miles per hour and have an incline of 20-30%. You burn 600-800 calories but your going at walking speed. I call it the hiking simulator.
- js2 9y ago
  I've never seen a treadmill that goes over 15% grade. 30% is almost a stair stepper.
  - woolvalley 9y ago
    Ah it is a pretty unique treadmill: https://www.freemotionfitness.com/cardio/incline-trainers https://www.freemotionfitness.com/cardio/incline-trainers They call it an incline trainer With stair steppers I found it a lot harder to sustain it for the same nominal calorie count. But going up a %30 incline vs a stair stepper might be the same difference between an elliptical vs running.

whatyoucantsay 9y ago

Then how did Courtney Dauwalter recently win the MOAB 240 race in Utah by over eight hours on a diet of nachos, candy and beer? She eats far more calories than a normal human could and is establishing new high marks in performance along the way. Not even the Tarahumara have put up her kind of numbers. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8DfjXnIk6c https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V8DfjXnIk6c A single hour on the treadmill will burn over 1,000 kcal for most somewhat fit people. It also increases their insulin sensitivity. The truth is most westerners and especially Americans are far too sedentary.

rarec 9y ago
I'm not sure what you're getting at. She doesn't eat/drink those things all the time. Michael Phelps ate an enormous amount of food too for his training too, and he trained very hard. I sincerely doubt him or Courtney devour that many calories when not in training or trying to run for five plus days straight. Short term gorging yourself for fuel is sometimes necessary, but it's dishonest to propose that means a diet of nachos, candy and beer is somehow healthy. If everyone was doing the MOAB all the time that's a different story.
- sushisource 9y ago
  You're definitely not wrong, but consistent long term training does keep you at a higher metabolic rate. I run pretty frequently (nothing like a ultra competition like that, though) and I can consistently eat ~3kcal a day and not gain a pound, even when maybe 1/3 to 1/2 of those days don't involve training. To be fair, I'm still young, and probably have a genetic predisposition to burning a lot of calories, but I still think it's fair to say that consistent training results in a generally higher caloric intake even when not training.
- whatyoucantsay 9y ago
  The only thing I was pointing out is that people can, in fact, "outwork a bad diet". It's not easy, but it's not impossible either.
gizmo686 9y ago

LyndsySimon 9y ago

> Some diets are more for short term benefit than others, like keto I've been on keto for ten months, and have lost ~70 pounds. I don't see it as a short-term change; I intend to spend the rest of my life either in ketosis or regularly spending time in that state.