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If you assume that anyone who reached different conclusions than you is stupid by definition, then you'll quite literally never be able to change your mind.

by edanm 9y ago

pklausler 9y ago
Nobody's stupid by definition. Lots of people are provably stupid by very short chains of reasoning, e.g. flat-earthers.
- AlexandrB 9y ago
  > Lots of people are provably stupid by very short chains of reasoning, e.g. flat-earthers. They're provably wrong by very short chains of reasoning. That's not the same as provably stupid. Even very smart, educated people can hold beliefs that are completely bonkers though a combination of cognitive dissonance and misinformation. For a very prominent example, take a look at how Steve Jobs dealt with his cancer [1]: > Despite his diagnosis, Jobs resisted his doctors' recommendations for medical intervention for nine months,[117] instead relying on a pseudo-medicine diet to try natural healing to thwart the disease. And that's setting aside the apparent confusion in this thread between intelligence and morality. Just because someone holds a stupid belief, doesn't mean they're a bad person, a threat to their coworkers, or unable to do their job. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Jobs#Health_issues https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Jobs#Health_issues
  - pklausler 9y ago
    Being persistently wrong, despite overwhelming evidence, is stupid.
fossuser 9y ago
I don't assume that - it depends on the conclusion and the reasoning that leads to it (obviously I can be wrong). I think some conclusions are stupid based on the available information. When people hold a lot of stupid conclusions or a few really strongly I doubt their ability to think critically in general. When someone has a different conclusion than I do, I'm curious about what reasoning lead to it, but often it's not an attempt to understand what's true based on available evidence. It's usually a conclusion they have for other reasons (identity? group association?) and they either can't articulate why they think the way they do or they retroactively come up with stuff that already fits their answer. The conclusion came before the reasoning about it. It's not about figuring out what's true. This is a problem outside of politics - it's a problem with how our minds work by default and how people think.

If you assume that anyone who reached different conclusions than you is stupid by definition, then you'll quite literally never be able to change your mind.

by edanm 9y ago

If you assume that anyone who reached different conclusions than you is stupid by definition, then you'll quite literally never be able to change your mind.

pklausler 9y ago

Nobody's stupid by definition. Lots of people are provably stupid by very short chains of reasoning, e.g. flat-earthers.

AlexandrB 9y ago
> Lots of people are provably stupid by very short chains of reasoning, e.g. flat-earthers. They're provably wrong by very short chains of reasoning. That's not the same as provably stupid. Even very smart, educated people can hold beliefs that are completely bonkers though a combination of cognitive dissonance and misinformation. For a very prominent example, take a look at how Steve Jobs dealt with his cancer [1]: > Despite his diagnosis, Jobs resisted his doctors' recommendations for medical intervention for nine months,[117] instead relying on a pseudo-medicine diet to try natural healing to thwart the disease. And that's setting aside the apparent confusion in this thread between intelligence and morality. Just because someone holds a stupid belief, doesn't mean they're a bad person, a threat to their coworkers, or unable to do their job. [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Jobs#Health_issues https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Steve_Jobs#Health_issues
- pklausler 9y ago
  Being persistently wrong, despite overwhelming evidence, is stupid.

fossuser 9y ago

I don't assume that - it depends on the conclusion and the reasoning that leads to it (obviously I can be wrong). I think some conclusions are stupid based on the available information. When people hold a lot of stupid conclusions or a few really strongly I doubt their ability to think critically in general. When someone has a different conclusion than I do, I'm curious about what reasoning lead to it, but often it's not an attempt to understand what's true based on available evidence. It's usually a conclusion they have for other reasons (identity? group association?) and they either can't articulate why they think the way they do or they retroactively come up with stuff that already fits their answer. The conclusion came before the reasoning about it. It's not about figuring out what's true. This is a problem outside of politics - it's a problem with how our minds work by default and how people think.