4 ms·

I feel really helpless, one person alone is essentially powerless, only governments and corporations are big enough to make a difference but they don't because

by tehabe 9y ago

I feel really helpless, one person alone is essentially powerless, only governments and corporations are big enough to make a difference but they don't because they don't "believe" it or have no incentives to do anything. (And no, boycotts are pointless). So essentially we are screwed and the people who will come after us will either have to come up with a technology to get CO2 out of the atmosphere back to 290-300 ppm or will have to live with a much more hostile environment than today. I'm extremely pessimistic right now.

J-dawg 9y ago
Recently I've been reading various books about how to avoid and control excessive anxiety. One piece of advice that I keep seeing is that I should not worry about things outside of my direct control. This idea is also a central component of stoicism. How then, should one process terrible news like this? One the one hand, the world is not thinking about climate change enough (certainly politicians aren't). But on the other hand, it seems impossible to maintain good mental health if one spends too much time thinking about these things. Part of me wants to stick my head in the sand and just get on with life (which seems to be what many people do anyway). How can I read news like this yet remain optimistic and positive? Maybe global warming deniers, rather than being stupid or brainwashed, are just instinctively better at protecting their own mental health?
- tehabe 9y ago
  I'm screwed!
  - J-dawg 9y ago
    I didn't mean to make you feel like that. My reply was trying to say, I feel the same as you, and I'm curious to know how other people manage to be fully aware of climate change yet remain positive and happy. Diederich's reply to your comment seems to be a good start!
    - tehabe 9y ago
      I know, I just forgot the sarcasm tags. But it really feels awful right now. I think I will shut down my computer for today. Take care.
- AcerbicZero 9y ago
  I'd guess you handle terrible news like this the same way you handle great news, by accepting the situation at present and avoiding allowing desires, fear, emotion, etc to control you.
- mannigfaltig 9y ago
  The problem is that anxiety is warranted in this case. You can’t do anything about solving the problem for everybody, but you can potentially save your own life: - Work like a madman to get into the 1%. - Move to a region that is self-sustaining and is little impacted by global warming. - Buy guns, tools and a farm.
  - Diederich 9y ago
    > Buy guns, tools and a farm Honest question: in the event of some kind of widespread collapse of civilization, there will be hundreds of millions of starving people. For the purpose of this question, I don't think it matters much whether its a 'fast' or 'slow' collapse. Assuming you have some kind of self sufficient farm and a bunch of guns and other defenses, does it seem likely that you can keep what food you have and what food you can produce in the future from a large number of starving people?
    - oh_sigh 9y ago
      It's not like hordes of people are going to come at your farm like a zombie invasion. The starving people in this scenario will be scattered, scared, and lacking the ability to share information and coordinate themselves.
      - Diederich 9y ago
        You could be right...but I encourage you to think that through very carefully. Even in most worst case scenarios of climate change killing most food production, it's a slow process, taking quite a few years. The people who might eventually come to take by force what someone has as a result of exceptional planning and execution could be the same people who have been politely asking for some extra food for years. And those hungry people have been thinking about it and talking to other hungry people about it for a good long time. Also: the local government and pseudo-government entities might insist on redistribution. And that redistribution might be entirely legal.
        9y ago
- cryoshon 9y ago
  >One piece of advice that I keep seeing is that I should not worry about things outside of my direct control. this is a typical refrain in totalitarian systems where the common people have no power over their own lives, nevermind things outside their own lives. idle "worry" is useless. start preparing for the revolution, devolution, or mere evolution that is coming our way.
Diederich 9y ago
My grandfather, then a pre-teen, walked a 10 mile trap line each day in Nebraska winters during the great depression with a rifle and collected various small animals that were brought back and eaten so his family would be less hungry. In his mid to late 20s, he received three wounds and a bucket of awards for his actions in Guadalcanal and Burma. His wife to be's family got by by making illegal moonshine and hiding from the feds in Oklahoma. The most important lesson he taught me was simple, and I've never forgotten it. Every day you're breathing is a good day. I understand the limitations of this statement; clinical depression is a real thing, and is, fortunately, largely treatable. And situational depression can be pretty brutal. You are alive. You are breathing. You don't know how many days you have left in your life. Most likely you have a lot. More importantly, you have little idea of what those days will bring you. I've been living in a lot of climate change related fear for decades now. 20 years ago, the science was just getting started, and nobody really understood most of the implications. The fact is, we are all pretty helpless about most everything. That you're here on Hacker News is an incredible twist of fate, rather than starving in a refugee camp somewhere. So, assuming you are not clinically depressed, I will say this: live today and rejoice in its wonder. If you are alive tomorrow, live it, and rejoice again. If it is our fate to succumb to the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Filter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Filter then so be it. We live in fantastic, interesting times. Enjoy the ride and do the best you can to fractionally move the various needles in good directions.
- AstralStorm 9y ago
  Live today and don't care what you leave for your children? I think someone famous said something to the effect. It is terribly selfish and even more shortsighted. (And then, the flood.) Were talking in massive changes in ecosystem in just about 4 generations (less than a century) if things continue as they are. Great Filter only applies to date not self inflicted. Global climate change and ecosystem destruction do not count. And the real truth is that you can be an optimist to a fault. Keep that in mind. Dire situations happen and require immediate responses. The main problem here is that humanity is not at the point where we can make these really at all.
  - 9y ago
Al-Khwarizmi 9y ago
If you live in a democracy, "governments" come from voters. So you can do your part by being active in politics and supporting parties or representatives who take serious action against global warming (by the way, especially but not exclusively if you are American, this might mean parties or representatives fall outside of the Overton window: I just cannot see how saving the planet can be compatible with US-style laissez-faire capitalism). Apart from living a carbon-light lifestyle, e.g. ditching the car. Of course one person cannot do anything about world problems, almost by definition, but if everyone did those things, we wouldn't even have the problem. Governments and corporations wouldn't be able to do much harm without the invaluable assistance of the millions of people that just don't care.
gdubs 9y ago
It's overwhelming. Paraphrasing on a lot of great thinkers: focusing on things that are out of your control is a direct path to misery. Unsolicited advice: every day, every one of us can focus on things that we do have control over. We can help other people, be kind to each other. We can knock on doors for organizations we believe will make a positive impact. I'm not advocating for wishful thinking – just that it can feel good to focus every day on the things that we can control, and make a difference in our own circles.
jogjayr 9y ago
> one person alone is essentially powerless Yes one person alone is powerless in the face of a global problem. We have to work together to solve this thing. Having said that, there are things one person can do to "do their part". 1. Reduce personal consumption. Household and transportation energy needs, and products account for large portions of GHG emissions. Getting serious about cutting waste can yield near order-of-magnitude improvements in your electricity bill [1], transportation spending [2]. Buying less stuff will do the same, and leave you significantly richer and happier. Hobbies and activities that emphasize personal effort and creating, over passive entertainment and spending will do the same (I'm still working on this part myself)[3]. Even though we don't have carbon taxes, spending is still often a useful proxy for emissions. The less you spend, the less you emit; it's not a perfect rule, but it's a useful guideline. 2. Vote and campaign for representatives who are serious about dealing with climate change. 3. Consider your "circle of control" i.e. the things that are actually within your power to do [4] and take care of those. Don't worry about the rest. 4. Expand your skills. This one sounds weird, but learning more skills is both a) a form of entertainment and b) allows you to substitute skill for consumption. For example, if you get moderately good at cellphone repair or appliance repair, you can keep your and your family's (and maybe even friends') cellphones and appliances going longer without replacement. This applies equally to areas such as home improvement, vehicle repair, gardening, physical fitness, sewing etc. Mastery in new areas is also shown to improve personal happiness. 1. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2015/03/25/cut-your-power-bill/ http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2015/03/25/cut-your-power-bil... 2. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/04/22/curing-your-clown-like-car-habit/ http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/04/22/curing-your-clown-... 3. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/12/05/muscle-over-motor/ http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/12/05/muscle-over-motor/ 4. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/10/07/how-big-is-your-circle-of-control/ http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/10/07/how-big-is-your-ci...

by tehabe 9y ago

J-dawg 9y ago

Recently I've been reading various books about how to avoid and control excessive anxiety. One piece of advice that I keep seeing is that I should not worry about things outside of my direct control. This idea is also a central component of stoicism. How then, should one process terrible news like this? One the one hand, the world is not thinking about climate change enough (certainly politicians aren't). But on the other hand, it seems impossible to maintain good mental health if one spends too much time thinking about these things. Part of me wants to stick my head in the sand and just get on with life (which seems to be what many people do anyway). How can I read news like this yet remain optimistic and positive? Maybe global warming deniers, rather than being stupid or brainwashed, are just instinctively better at protecting their own mental health?

tehabe 9y ago
I'm screwed!
- J-dawg 9y ago
  I didn't mean to make you feel like that. My reply was trying to say, I feel the same as you, and I'm curious to know how other people manage to be fully aware of climate change yet remain positive and happy. Diederich's reply to your comment seems to be a good start!
  - tehabe 9y ago
    I know, I just forgot the sarcasm tags. But it really feels awful right now. I think I will shut down my computer for today. Take care.
AcerbicZero 9y ago
I'd guess you handle terrible news like this the same way you handle great news, by accepting the situation at present and avoiding allowing desires, fear, emotion, etc to control you.
mannigfaltig 9y ago
The problem is that anxiety is warranted in this case. You can’t do anything about solving the problem for everybody, but you can potentially save your own life: - Work like a madman to get into the 1%. - Move to a region that is self-sustaining and is little impacted by global warming. - Buy guns, tools and a farm.
- Diederich 9y ago
  > Buy guns, tools and a farm Honest question: in the event of some kind of widespread collapse of civilization, there will be hundreds of millions of starving people. For the purpose of this question, I don't think it matters much whether its a 'fast' or 'slow' collapse. Assuming you have some kind of self sufficient farm and a bunch of guns and other defenses, does it seem likely that you can keep what food you have and what food you can produce in the future from a large number of starving people?
  - oh_sigh 9y ago
    It's not like hordes of people are going to come at your farm like a zombie invasion. The starving people in this scenario will be scattered, scared, and lacking the ability to share information and coordinate themselves.
    - Diederich 9y ago
      You could be right...but I encourage you to think that through very carefully. Even in most worst case scenarios of climate change killing most food production, it's a slow process, taking quite a few years. The people who might eventually come to take by force what someone has as a result of exceptional planning and execution could be the same people who have been politely asking for some extra food for years. And those hungry people have been thinking about it and talking to other hungry people about it for a good long time. Also: the local government and pseudo-government entities might insist on redistribution. And that redistribution might be entirely legal.
      - 9y ago
cryoshon 9y ago
>One piece of advice that I keep seeing is that I should not worry about things outside of my direct control. this is a typical refrain in totalitarian systems where the common people have no power over their own lives, nevermind things outside their own lives. idle "worry" is useless. start preparing for the revolution, devolution, or mere evolution that is coming our way.

Diederich 9y ago

My grandfather, then a pre-teen, walked a 10 mile trap line each day in Nebraska winters during the great depression with a rifle and collected various small animals that were brought back and eaten so his family would be less hungry. In his mid to late 20s, he received three wounds and a bucket of awards for his actions in Guadalcanal and Burma. His wife to be's family got by by making illegal moonshine and hiding from the feds in Oklahoma. The most important lesson he taught me was simple, and I've never forgotten it. Every day you're breathing is a good day. I understand the limitations of this statement; clinical depression is a real thing, and is, fortunately, largely treatable. And situational depression can be pretty brutal. You are alive. You are breathing. You don't know how many days you have left in your life. Most likely you have a lot. More importantly, you have little idea of what those days will bring you. I've been living in a lot of climate change related fear for decades now. 20 years ago, the science was just getting started, and nobody really understood most of the implications. The fact is, we are all pretty helpless about most everything. That you're here on Hacker News is an incredible twist of fate, rather than starving in a refugee camp somewhere. So, assuming you are not clinically depressed, I will say this: live today and rejoice in its wonder. If you are alive tomorrow, live it, and rejoice again. If it is our fate to succumb to the https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Filter https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Filter then so be it. We live in fantastic, interesting times. Enjoy the ride and do the best you can to fractionally move the various needles in good directions.

AstralStorm 9y ago
Live today and don't care what you leave for your children? I think someone famous said something to the effect. It is terribly selfish and even more shortsighted. (And then, the flood.) Were talking in massive changes in ecosystem in just about 4 generations (less than a century) if things continue as they are. Great Filter only applies to date not self inflicted. Global climate change and ecosystem destruction do not count. And the real truth is that you can be an optimist to a fault. Keep that in mind. Dire situations happen and require immediate responses. The main problem here is that humanity is not at the point where we can make these really at all.
- 9y ago

Al-Khwarizmi 9y ago

If you live in a democracy, "governments" come from voters. So you can do your part by being active in politics and supporting parties or representatives who take serious action against global warming (by the way, especially but not exclusively if you are American, this might mean parties or representatives fall outside of the Overton window: I just cannot see how saving the planet can be compatible with US-style laissez-faire capitalism). Apart from living a carbon-light lifestyle, e.g. ditching the car. Of course one person cannot do anything about world problems, almost by definition, but if everyone did those things, we wouldn't even have the problem. Governments and corporations wouldn't be able to do much harm without the invaluable assistance of the millions of people that just don't care.

gdubs 9y ago

It's overwhelming. Paraphrasing on a lot of great thinkers: focusing on things that are out of your control is a direct path to misery. Unsolicited advice: every day, every one of us can focus on things that we do have control over. We can help other people, be kind to each other. We can knock on doors for organizations we believe will make a positive impact. I'm not advocating for wishful thinking – just that it can feel good to focus every day on the things that we can control, and make a difference in our own circles.

jogjayr 9y ago

> one person alone is essentially powerless Yes one person alone is powerless in the face of a global problem. We have to work together to solve this thing. Having said that, there are things one person can do to "do their part". 1. Reduce personal consumption. Household and transportation energy needs, and products account for large portions of GHG emissions. Getting serious about cutting waste can yield near order-of-magnitude improvements in your electricity bill [1], transportation spending [2]. Buying less stuff will do the same, and leave you significantly richer and happier. Hobbies and activities that emphasize personal effort and creating, over passive entertainment and spending will do the same (I'm still working on this part myself)[3]. Even though we don't have carbon taxes, spending is still often a useful proxy for emissions. The less you spend, the less you emit; it's not a perfect rule, but it's a useful guideline. 2. Vote and campaign for representatives who are serious about dealing with climate change. 3. Consider your "circle of control" i.e. the things that are actually within your power to do [4] and take care of those. Don't worry about the rest. 4. Expand your skills. This one sounds weird, but learning more skills is both a) a form of entertainment and b) allows you to substitute skill for consumption. For example, if you get moderately good at cellphone repair or appliance repair, you can keep your and your family's (and maybe even friends') cellphones and appliances going longer without replacement. This applies equally to areas such as home improvement, vehicle repair, gardening, physical fitness, sewing etc. Mastery in new areas is also shown to improve personal happiness. 1. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2015/03/25/cut-your-power-bill/ http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2015/03/25/cut-your-power-bil... 2. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/04/22/curing-your-clown-like-car-habit/ http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/04/22/curing-your-clown-... 3. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/12/05/muscle-over-motor/ http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2011/12/05/muscle-over-motor/ 4. http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/10/07/how-big-is-your-circle-of-control/ http://www.mrmoneymustache.com/2013/10/07/how-big-is-your-ci...