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> Wastes bandwidth downloading content in the background. Wastes battery rendering content in the background. That’s Google Search, not AMP. How much bandwidth

> Wastes bandwidth downloading content in the background. Wastes battery rendering content in the background. That’s Google Search, not AMP. How much bandwidth does Search use? Is it big enough to be a problem for some users? > Downloads Google links you haven’t given permission you want to see. Google Search can load assets from its own domain, like any other website. The user can use browser extensions to block certain requests. > You can’t even opt out. You mean you can’t opt out of seeing AMP results on Google Search? Well, yes, for obvious reasons. AMP is Google’s product. It would make little sense for them to add such an option. > Breaks the web url extending it for Google’s own purposes. Breaks the understanding that the domain you are on is the authority for it’s own content. Yes, it does. > Copying URLs to send to friends or post online no longer works correctly. It works in iOS Safari and Firefox for Android (and probably other browsers as well), which use the canonical URL when the user shares the page. There is also a Share button in the header of the AMP page. > Traps publishers further inside Google’s web, not the open web. You can say that Google traps publishers, but not that AMP is not the open web. Google AMP Cache is a website on the (open) web.

nailer 9y ago
> That’s Google Search, not AMP. That's AMP. AMP prefetches content from AMP sites which must be hosted on google.com. The AMP team, when asked about hosting AMP content outside google.com, mention they can't prefetch from other domains with current tech as a blocker for this.
- SimeVidas 9y ago
  That’s Google AMP Cache, to be specific, which is used by Google Search. I was pointing out that the (alleged) extra bandwidth and battery use happens then the user visits Google’s website. I’d limit the term AMP to the library and framework for creating AMP pages.
  - tareqak 9y ago
    What term would you give for how Google Search treats AMP pages from regular HTML pages?
    - SquareWheel 9y ago
      That's Google's implementation of the AMP Cache. It acts as a CDN for pages that implement the AMP standard. https://developers.google.com/amp/cache/ https://developers.google.com/amp/cache/
      - tareqak 9y ago
        OK, why does Google put AMP pages on Google's implementation of the AMP cache above the carousel in mobile, or add the AMP icon to search results that are AMP pages? If AMP pages are faster than regular HTML pages, then Google Search's ranking algorithm would rank higher these faster pages organically.
        manigandham 9y ago
        The biggest issue is that if search results were actually ranked by speed, sites would already become 100x faster without any of this AMP nonsense.
        SquareWheel 9y ago
        This seems to be a common misunderstanding, but page speed is already a search ranking factor. https://webmasters.googleblog.com/2010/04/using-site-speed-in-web-search-ranking.html https://webmasters.googleblog.com/2010/04/using-site-speed-i...
        manigandham 9y ago
        It's nowhere near significant enough to matter, unlike AMP which guarantees higher placement.
        ENGNR 9y ago
owebmaster 9y ago
> You can say that Google traps publishers, but not that AMP is not the open web. Google AMP Cache is a website on the (open) web. This doesn't make any sense. Why would a google trap be "the open web"? Google & Google Cache & Google Search isn't open web. It is deductive that google doesn't show you the best resources available on the web but the ones that are of their interest.
- SimeVidas 9y ago
  When I think “not the open web,” I think native apps (Android, iOS, etc.), I think internet censorship (a country blocking an entire website), I think fast lanes, zero-rating, and other ways ISPs are undermining net neutrality. AMP is neither of those things. It’s a library and framework for creating web pages which are then hosted on the web, openly.
  - AlexandrB 9y ago
    > AMP is neither of those things. It’s a library and framework for creating web pages which are then hosted on the web, openly. In practice it's a framework for hosting web pages on Google's domain. I haven't seen any amp sites outside of the google.com domain. To call google.com "the open web" is quite a stretch. I can't control anything about google.com, and I'm bound to Google's policies and practices when hosting content there. How is this open in any meaningful sense?
    - davidcbc 9y ago
      Which hosting providers would qualify as open then? You are bound by the policies and practices of the owner anywhere you host your content.
      - juliangoldsmith 9y ago
        Generally, you can switch hosting providers. When there's only one AMP host, you're stuck with them forever.
    - 9y ago
482794793792894 9y ago
Your response is largely grappling onto questionable technicalities with no explanation for your viewpoint and absolutely no relevance. If you're on Google's PR team and paid to put up something against negative comments, believe me that this only makes your product look worse when done on HN. This may work on more fun-centric online communities and especially on less tech-focused communities, but not here. If you stand up for Google, you better be making an actual argument and not prove that there's no actual arguments to defend Google's doing.
- SimeVidas 9y ago
  I’m just an independent writer. I know a bit about AMP, so I thought I’d clarify some things and share the information that I have.
- sctb 9y ago
  Even as a hypothetical, this sidles up to an accusation of shillage, which the guidelines as us not to do because it's not substantive. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html

nailer 9y ago

> That’s Google Search, not AMP. That's AMP. AMP prefetches content from AMP sites which must be hosted on google.com. The AMP team, when asked about hosting AMP content outside google.com, mention they can't prefetch from other domains with current tech as a blocker for this.

SimeVidas 9y ago
That’s Google AMP Cache, to be specific, which is used by Google Search. I was pointing out that the (alleged) extra bandwidth and battery use happens then the user visits Google’s website. I’d limit the term AMP to the library and framework for creating AMP pages.
- tareqak 9y ago
  What term would you give for how Google Search treats AMP pages from regular HTML pages?
  - SquareWheel 9y ago
    That's Google's implementation of the AMP Cache. It acts as a CDN for pages that implement the AMP standard. https://developers.google.com/amp/cache/ https://developers.google.com/amp/cache/
    - tareqak 9y ago
      OK, why does Google put AMP pages on Google's implementation of the AMP cache above the carousel in mobile, or add the AMP icon to search results that are AMP pages? If AMP pages are faster than regular HTML pages, then Google Search's ranking algorithm would rank higher these faster pages organically.
      - manigandham 9y ago
        The biggest issue is that if search results were actually ranked by speed, sites would already become 100x faster without any of this AMP nonsense.
        SquareWheel 9y ago
        This seems to be a common misunderstanding, but page speed is already a search ranking factor. https://webmasters.googleblog.com/2010/04/using-site-speed-in-web-search-ranking.html https://webmasters.googleblog.com/2010/04/using-site-speed-i...
        manigandham 9y ago
        It's nowhere near significant enough to matter, unlike AMP which guarantees higher placement.
        ENGNR 9y ago

owebmaster 9y ago

> You can say that Google traps publishers, but not that AMP is not the open web. Google AMP Cache is a website on the (open) web. This doesn't make any sense. Why would a google trap be "the open web"? Google & Google Cache & Google Search isn't open web. It is deductive that google doesn't show you the best resources available on the web but the ones that are of their interest.

SimeVidas 9y ago
When I think “not the open web,” I think native apps (Android, iOS, etc.), I think internet censorship (a country blocking an entire website), I think fast lanes, zero-rating, and other ways ISPs are undermining net neutrality. AMP is neither of those things. It’s a library and framework for creating web pages which are then hosted on the web, openly.
- AlexandrB 9y ago
  > AMP is neither of those things. It’s a library and framework for creating web pages which are then hosted on the web, openly. In practice it's a framework for hosting web pages on Google's domain. I haven't seen any amp sites outside of the google.com domain. To call google.com "the open web" is quite a stretch. I can't control anything about google.com, and I'm bound to Google's policies and practices when hosting content there. How is this open in any meaningful sense?
  - davidcbc 9y ago
    Which hosting providers would qualify as open then? You are bound by the policies and practices of the owner anywhere you host your content.
    - juliangoldsmith 9y ago
      Generally, you can switch hosting providers. When there's only one AMP host, you're stuck with them forever.
  - 9y ago

482794793792894 9y ago

Your response is largely grappling onto questionable technicalities with no explanation for your viewpoint and absolutely no relevance. If you're on Google's PR team and paid to put up something against negative comments, believe me that this only makes your product look worse when done on HN. This may work on more fun-centric online communities and especially on less tech-focused communities, but not here. If you stand up for Google, you better be making an actual argument and not prove that there's no actual arguments to defend Google's doing.

SimeVidas 9y ago
I’m just an independent writer. I know a bit about AMP, so I thought I’d clarify some things and share the information that I have.
sctb 9y ago
Even as a hypothetical, this sidles up to an accusation of shillage, which the guidelines as us not to do because it's not substantive. https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html https://news.ycombinator.com/newsguidelines.html